Author Topic: Chapter Tactics  (Read 7008 times)

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Offline Nightwing7x

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Re: Chapter Tactics
« Reply #15 on: August 27, 2017, 02:45:14 PM »
A good theory brother. However if every Dark Angel could reroll 1s to hit that would be a little overpowered in my opinion. The losing only 1 guy from leadership I can understand however.

Offline Rezial

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Re: Chapter Tactics
« Reply #16 on: September 05, 2017, 09:21:30 PM »
Losing only 1 from morale seems like a pretty decent version of Stubborn for 8th Edition.  I still think a lot of DA models will have a version of Fearless too though.  Greenwing core rule will probably be something to do with shooting I would think though.  If they keep it as an Overwatch mod I guess that would follow 6th and 7th ok but I definitely don't want it stipulated in remaining still.  Seems too weak compared to Ultramarines, Raven Guard, and White Scars.  GW really needs something in the First Legion to make players want to buy Primaris troops besides just being a two wound Tactical.  Otherwise it will be purely Deathwing and Ravenwing again.

Another interesting thing to watch out for of course but one other thing I think is likely is that Dark Angels won't see a book until after Christmas.  Could be a blessing in disguise if codex power creep doesn't start falling off for no reason.  As long as Eldar and IG don't receive any noticeable buffs from their indexes DA should then be in a good spot. 
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Offline Nightwing7x

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Re: Chapter Tactics
« Reply #17 on: September 17, 2017, 10:34:49 AM »
Brother Rezial, you have brought up a good point. Our "core" chapter tactic should be very unique compared to the others as we are the first legion, however I truly cannot think of anything other than maybe something involving plasma. We do have a bit of a plasma fetish. Perhaps something such as rolls of 1 with a plasma weapon just inflict a mortal wound instead of out right killing whoever is using it? However even that seems very lack luster as normally its 1 wound infantry that carry plasma to begin with and the bigger stuff like dreadnoughts already just take a mortal wound from it.

Actually perhaps we could have a rule where if you do roll a 1 for gets hot, roll the dice again and only on another 1 does that model suffer a mortal wound or die, however the shot still does not go off regardless of the reroll from this rule. However here is to hoping that gw actually comes up with something creative, fluffy and unique.

The fearless point brings something up however. Last edition almost every single one of our characters, named or not, were fearless. Which was great as whatever unit you stuck them in, were not going to run anytime soon. What in the Emperor's name does that do now. Nothing. How can we fix that?

Offline Rezial

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Re: Chapter Tactics
« Reply #18 on: October 07, 2017, 04:44:16 PM »
Well I have been re-reading a lot of Chapter lore this week and it seems to me the Dark Angels as a Legion were known for Strategic superiority, martial prowess, and being completely dauntless.  Based on those factors I could see them operating very similarly to Ultramarines on many levels but with specific traits affecting morale or leadership and close combat buffs for characters and hopefully Sergeants by extension.  This could take the form of stratagems in the new edition pretty easily.  The other buffs or unique features we get are the organization and wargear options unique to the First of course.  Outside of Grey Knights and some shenanigans with Lone Wolfs the Deathwing are still the best Terminators and the Ravenwing I think are better than White Scars even while we're still an index army.
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Offline Nightwing7x

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Re: Chapter Tactics
« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2017, 08:55:21 PM »
I have also been reading some lore myself strangely enough. I picked up the Horus Heresy novel Angels of Caliban, I am about half way through the book and highly recommend it. During my time reading it, it occurred to me that perhaps we might see a return of the old wings with the return of our primarch and potentially a break from the codex astartes for many chapters.

I hope we get synergy back between the wings, as it stands it seems that just playing 1 wing at a time is the best bet, that is not how this army should work fluff wise. On the note about the Ultramarines, we are known for our tactical prowess and hopefully we get a warlord trait or something to reflect such. Perhaps a copy and paste of the get a command point back on a 5+.

Personally I wish interrogator's had a little more going for them as it stands, or a drop in points because they do not feel worth 90 points. Finally I cannot wait to see our new psychic powers, interromancy has always been the odd ball of psychic powers in my opinion, but a fun discipline none the less.

Offline Nightwing7x

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Re: Chapter Tactics
« Reply #20 on: October 15, 2017, 11:26:35 PM »
Brothers hold on for a moment...something just hit me, what if we get our old banners back as relics?!?!? I know it has nothing to do with chapter tactics but I thought I would share it because it seems like there is some potential there.

Offline Rezial

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Re: Chapter Tactics
« Reply #21 on: October 23, 2017, 06:02:04 PM »
Well the Ancients being separate I imagine there could be more than one option for banners as well as it being likely we could see a banner as a relic.  I was in a conversation with the owner of my local Warhammer store not long ago and even though he isn't allowed to speak directly of any foreknowledge he has he did hint at some things to me.  On the topic of the Lion returning he said not to get my hopes up.  He cited that since Forge World haven't made their Lion yet GW is unlikely to do so first.
 The direction of the conversation was that Russ was more likely unfortunately.  Also there are now rumors of an Angron model.  He did say that Dark Angels players should be excited for a story event in the spring though.  Couldn't get more than that for now.

I am assuming this could point to a lull in GW release of 40k at and around Christmas after which we may see a Codex in late winter or early spring.  One could still hope to see the Primarch but no telling now.

Chaplains are a tough one.  They work best for units that want to assault but traditionally Dark Angel tactics favor shooting slightly more.  My hope is to see that change and allow DA players a very strong assault unit option where Interrogators can shine.
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Offline Nightwing7x

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Re: Chapter Tactics
« Reply #22 on: November 05, 2017, 10:02:48 AM »
Here is to hopping that we called it brothers: http://natfka.blogspot.co.uk/2017/11/rumors-dark-angels-leaks-and-codex.html. If so we were spot on.

Offline Rezial

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Re: Chapter Tactics
« Reply #23 on: December 30, 2017, 08:09:40 PM »
So it appears now post-Codex drop some of our prediction were spot on and some not as much.  I am overall very happy with this release though.  As much as it's a shame Deathwing are basically not viable by themselves it's not too bad.  I always preferred mixed-wing builds myself and this new book champions that.  Some of the core rules we speculated on are exactly as discussed.  I see the character buffs I hoped for are definitely there in a mix of stratagems and relics.  Shame about the loss of all our unique banners.  But we got some unexpected greatness in Weapons of the Dark Age.  Ravenwing and "Greenwing" came out like champs over all.  Azrael is widely considered one of the best Chapter Masters, hurrah!  And Asmodai is getting love?  Whaaaaaaat?!  Hellblasters.  Wow.  More on that elsewhere perhaps.  Yeah I'm definitely pretty pleased.  Others thoughts?
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Online Breng77

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Re: Chapter Tactics
« Reply #24 on: January 04, 2018, 03:31:35 PM »
I would say that both wings are not really viable on their own.  Ravenwing has many good units but would lack CP in a mono-RW build (caps out at 6 if you fill 3 Outrider detachments), it also lacks chaff to prevent deepstrike alpha strikes from removing your bikes from the table.

I think A battalion with 3 scout squads will be a common include in all DA lists, then branch out from there.

Beyond that both Landspeeder characters are great, Plasma Inceptors are the big winner in the book with WOTDA, and Regular RW bikes are also very good.

Having played a bit I think most competitive lists will involve allies because you can mix match chapter tactics to your advantage.  Mono-DA builds will likely revolve around Greenwing with Azzy and some RW elements or Deepstriking inceptors and characters.

Offline Nightwing7x

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Re: Chapter Tactics
« Reply #25 on: January 14, 2018, 11:17:15 AM »
While Deathwing did get hit pretty hard, on there own, which is a shame because I love them. The new DA are quite the force. I made a 2k point list with the release of the new book and it is about 80% greenwing, then 10% Ravenwing and Deathwing. I have not lost with it yet. My most common opponent, Deathguard, always try to drop typhus with some deathshroud by my back line, which they always manage to get the charge off, because of course they do. However with the new auspex scans, my opponent now dreads my backline, which has plasma cannon devs.

Another friend of mine, who plays tau, hates my devs as well, because he to dropped them by my 3 damage plasma devs, once. Then my deathguard friend also plays grey knights, and he always uses Draigo with paladins in deepstrike, which my devs now destroy, and paladins only can get a 5+ invuln sooooooo yeah.

Overall I love the new book, though IMO, Azrael breaks the internal balance of the book. I have barely any reason not to take him in the list, unless I want it to be fluffy.