Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.

Topics - DCannon4Life

Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 7
Discussion: Eldar / 8th Ed. War Walkers (submitted for inclusion in Guide)
« on: November 01, 2017, 11:28:22 AM »
War Walkers

Stat Line
• Unchanged from Index

Main Playstyles & Loadouts
• In my view, there are two ways to play War Walkers: 1) As scouts, taking advantage of their 8th edition “Outflank” rule to get behind enemy lines asap. 2) As support platforms, leveraging the Alaitoc Craftworld Trait to significantly increase their survivability in conjunction with being an attractive target for buffs (Guide).
• Along with these playstyles, I think there are two clearly superior loadouts: Shuriken Cannons for ‘Scout’ Walkers and Bright Lances for ‘Support’ Walkers.

Weapon Options

Shuriken cannon (ONLY ‘Scout’ Walker loadout)
• The best option for ‘Scout’ Walkers. With the removal of armor facing from the game, there is no longer any significant advantage gained by outflanking the other heavy weapons. Now, the only reason to do so would be to line up parallel to the back edge of the table, where the walkers are likely to have unobstructed views of the opposing backfield (given common terrain placement rules). Shuriken cannons being the only heavy weapon designated as Assault makes them clearly superior on a unit that is intended to move. ‘Scout’ Walkers do not HAVE to start off the board however, given their fast movement and no penalty for Advancing, they can be placed on the flanks and move well up the board on turn one (not recommended for Hammer & Anvil style deployments, where it’s still better to Outflank). ‘Scout’ Walkers are good, perhaps even best, as Biel Tan, where they put the Craftworld Trait to good use.

Scatter laser (Not Recommended)
• The Scatter Laser did not transition to 8th edition very well. The Heavy tag and lack of AP (They used to be AP6, right?) mean that they don’t perform well. If they had been moved into the Assault category, there would be potential for debate between their range and volume of shots compared to the Shuriken Cannon’s ‘magic sixes’ rule. Alas, they did not, and so are the least attractive of the weapon options.

Star cannon (Not Recommended)
• The Star Cannon is…in an awkward place. You want it on a platform that is either not going to move, or that has access to the Crystal Targeting Matrix. Regardless, Star Cannons seem over-priced compared to their performance; balancing and point-costing D3 damage weapons is difficult. I would not argue that Star Cannons are unplayable, they’re just not competitive.

Bright lance (Primary ‘Support’ Walker Loadout)
• The Bright Lance is THE weapon to use on support walkers. If you’re concerned about alpha-strikes, then you can still Outflank them, but just bring them on into your backfield, where they can be buffed (Guide) to make up for the movement penalty they incur. Otherwise, make sure they are Alaitoc, in cover (and Obscured) and plink away.

Aeldari missile launcher (Secondary ‘Support’ Walker Loadout)
• Missile launchers, in general, are in an odd place in 8th edition. In my opinion they could all stand to be 2 points cheaper than they are. LasCannons are easy to understand and clearly worth their points. Missile launchers seem to be paying a ‘utility’ tax that just doesn’t come into play often enough to warrant the extra cost. Aeldari missile launchers are worth consideration because Doom exists. If it didn’t, then only Bright Lances would be a valid option. Doom boosts the Aeldari missile launcher’s performance to near Bright Lance levels, meaning that the secondary function (“Sunburst”), with its AP-1, also becomes interesting. Without additional support from a Farseer, the Aeldari missile launcher is not as attractive as the Bright Lance. If you want flexibility in your weapon system, and are willing to invest the extra points to support the unit, the Aeldari missile launcher is for you.

• Outflank is back! Thank goodness for this. The Index iteration of the Craftworlds was very light on ways to put units in reserves. I got rather tired of seeing my War Walkers shot off the table before they got to do anything. Now, as with all glass cannon units, they are able to engage, at least once, on their own terms. Just remember that even if you are running ‘Support’ Walkers, you can, and sometimes should, still hold them off the table. They will be high-priority targets, so taking a -1 To Hit for a turn will always be worth having them around for longer.

Synergies & Best Craftworlds
• Guide and Doom are obvious synergies, particularly for ‘Support’ Walkers. One of the BEST synergies, also requiring a Farseer, is the Forewarned Stratagem! Another excellent Stratagem is Fire and Fade.
• ‘Support’ Walkers are, unsurprisingly, best played as Alaitoc, with Ulthwe coming in second. ‘Scout’ Walkers are best played as Biel Tan, as they can and will often be operating on their own.

Support Weapons

Stat Line
• Unchanged from the Index


• With a short range and variable number of shots, the D-cannon will not make your opponent quake in fear. And given that you cannot buff more than one support weapon at a time (due to Support Weapon deployment rules), the D-cannon is not going to be worth the points in competitive lists. However, given its small footprint, no-look shooting (what a difference that makes!), improved strength and reasonable cost per D-cannon (~3 LasCannons), it is still a solid, playable choice. On a table with more than an average amount of terrain, an Alaitoc D-cannon could be a nightmare (Alaitoc is clearly the best option, with Ulthwe coming in second).

Shadow weaver
• The Shadow weaver, a favorite of mine in 6th and 7th edition due to its low investment cost and capacity to over-perform (particularly with Guide), now serves as the cheapest way to unlock a Brigade, though not the best choice, point-for-point (I think the War Walker wins out). Previously, the ability to stack templates on elite units (and fish for 6’s) was the way to go. Now, due to the fact that you cannot buff, except via auras, support weapons, the Shadow weaver has lost most of its offensive appeal. Still, it is useful as a cheap backfield objective-holder that is hard to shift (Alaitoc, in cover, and out of Line of Sight) and still able to reach out to other parts of the table (chipping away at your opponent’s backfield objective holders throughout the game).

Vibro cannon
• Ah, the much neglected Vibro cannon is back (in a relative way)! While the Vibro cannon does not enjoy the advantage of no-look shooting that the D-cannon and Shadow weaver have, it does, without question, have the most interesting (and verbose) Ability description of the three. This version of the support weapon is the only one it makes sense to take three of straightaway, as they are now a variable shot AutoCannon that improves in AP and To Wound rolls for each successive Vibro cannon that hits the same target, up to two more. That puts the third Vibro cannon on 2’s To Wound versus T7, at AP-3. Not unimpressive, for less than a 200 point investment. And, as a final perk, any unit that suffers a wound (has damage inflicted on it) from a Vibro cannon cannot Advance in its next Movement phase (with an exception for units that can Fly). None of this makes the Vibro cannon a competitive choice for tournament play, but it certainly does make them more viable than they’ve been in a long time. It’s even more vital for Vibro cannons to be Alaitoc than anything else, as they have to have Line of Sight to their targets.

Synergies & Best Craftworlds
• Unfortunately, due to 8th edition rules for artillery-style units, there are no synergies worth capitalizing on, other than perhaps a re-roll 1’s aura. Fortunately, support weapons seem to be priced with this in mind.
• Alaitoc is, hands down, the best Craftworld for support weapons. Even if you’re not taking an entirely Alaitoc army, you should consider taking an Alaitoc Heavy Support detachment if you plan on using support weapons. Ulthwe is a reasonable alternative.

Hey all,

When we all get our shiny books, I'll be eager to start talking rules!

Discussion: Eldar / Everyone Ready?
« on: May 23, 2017, 09:49:02 AM »
I look forward to beginning to post theorycrafting for Newdar (Aeldari). See you all June 17!

Discussion: Painting / Updated Avatar
« on: August 10, 2015, 02:51:27 PM »
Got 40K ADD (when I don't paint/build the next thing on the 'schedule') again this week. Decided to spruce up and rebase my Avatar. The first pic is before (I painted him ~3 years ago or more). The rest are what he looks like now:

--Tournament strength list with list-building restrictions (only one LoW, no repeat formations/detachments, for example)
--Tournament will feature 50/50 Maelstrom & 'Classic' missions
--Not looking to have these lists tailored, just looking for an opinion on which you think is strongest
--Please consider them all vis a vis 3 GravCents with Tigurius, in a Drop Pod (in addition to whatever you think is nasty)

I look forward to your responses! :)

LIST ONE: Scatbikes & Friends

Primary Detachment: CRAFTWORLD WARHOST
[All units in this detachment automatically run 6” if they elect to run]

Windrider Host
[All Shuriken weapons gain Shred once per game, if Far Seer is still alive]
•   Far Seer (Jet Bike, Spirit Stone, Singing Spear) 140
•   SOLO Warlock (Jet Bike, Singing Spear) 55
•   9 Scatter Bikes 243
•   3 Scatter Bikes 81
•   3 Scatter Bikes 81
•   2 Vypers (Shuriken Cannon & Twin-Linked Shuriken Catapults) 80
Hero of the Craftworld
•   Autarch (Swooping Hawk Wings, Banshee Mask, Fusion Gun, Power Sword) 115
Aspect Host
[All units are +1BS and reroll failed Morale, Fear, etc.]
•   7 Warp Spiders (Exarch) 143
•   7 Warp Spiders (Exarch) 143
•   7 Swooping Hawks (Exarch) 122
Wraith Construct
•   Wraith Knight (Ghost Glaive, Scatter Shield) 295

TOTAL: 1498

LIST TWO: Guardians Getting it Done, aka, 'Dude, where's my ride?'

Guardian Battle Host
[Vyper, War Walkers and Support Batteries have Preferred Enemy when shooting at targets within 12” of one of the units of Guardians from this formation] =
•   Far Seer (Spirit Stone) 115
•   10 Guardians (Eldar Missile Launcher) 90
•   10 Guardians (Eldar Missile Launcher) 90
•   10 Guardians (Eldar Missile Launcher) 90
•   1 Vyper  (Shuriken Cannon) 40
•   3 War Walkers (2 Scatter Lasers each) 180
•   3 Shadow Weavers 90
Hero of the Craftworld
•   Autarch (Swooping Hawk Wings, Banshee Mask, Fusion Gun) 100
Aspect Host
[All units are +1BS and reroll failed Morale, Fear, etc.] = 408
•   7 Warp Spiders (Exarch) 143
•   7 Warp Spiders (Exarch) 143
•   7 Swooping Hawks (Exarch) 122
Wraith Construct
•   Wraith Knight (Ghost Glaive & Scatter Shield) 295

TOTAL: 1498

LIST THREE: Hornets in a CaD

Craftworld Eldar Combined Arms Detachment:

Autarch (Swooping Hawk Wings, Fusion Gun, Power Sword) 110

3 Jetbikes 51
3 Jetbikes 51

3 Hornets (2 Pulse Lasers Each) 240

3 Distortion Cannons 165
3 War Walkers (Scatter Lasers) 180

Wraith Knight (Ghost Glaive & Scatter Shield) 295

Aspect Host
[All units are +1BS and reroll failed Morale, Fear, etc.] = 408
•   7 Warp Spiders (Exarch) 143
•   7 Warp Spiders (Exarch) 143
•   7 Swooping Hawks (Exarch) 122

TOTAL: 1500

Ok, so I've play Distortion Cannons for a while...and I sure do like them! A couple of weeks ago, one of my opponents looked at my list and said, "So...where are the D-Cannons?" The list had two Glaive Knights in it, so I didn't think I needed Distortion Cannons on top of all that....  :P

I will look at each variation of Vaul's Wrath Support Battery (henceforth: artillery) in turn, starting with Shadow Weavers and finishing with Distortion Cannons.

First, some points in general:
For 90 or 165 Points, you get 12 wounds worth of T7 models. Granted, you only really get, what, 10 of those wounds before the unit is completely neutered. Still, with a mix of 3+ and 5+ saves, depending on where the shooting is coming from, if you put these guys in Ruins, they're hard to dig out. Also--they confer the T7 to any Independent Character joined to the unit, making them the BEST place for your Farseer, unless you're running a Jet Council, of course.

So, on Turn One, either bring the high-strength, low-AP Ignores Cover shooting, or bring Psychics. Otherwise, you're not getting rid of them. Important to point out that they do well vs. Grav weapons because (so long as the Guardians outnumber the guns) the unit has a 5+ majority armor save!

They are only LD8, so they may well run if they lose too many models (remember that it is MODELS removed from shooting attacks, not wounds taken, that force Morale Checks). The fact that they are a mandatory inclusion in the Guardian-Based Cores of a Craftworld Warhost is not a bad thing, not a bad thing at all.

Shadow Weavers: "What's not to love?"
So, starting with Shadow Weavers. It is difficult to find another unit with as much utility and survivability per point (nothing comes to mind). Shadow Weavers have two significant advantages. 1) They have a 48" range and are Barrage weapons. Thus, they can be placed for survivability (including out of LoS) and still reach out and touch things. 2) They operate on the 'Monofilament' mechanism for determining wounds caused. That is, they wound almost everything in the game on a 2+.

While an open 'V' facing your opponent is optimal deployment, since they cost so little, there isn't as much pressure to get maximum effect out of them. Shadow Weavers are a 'bunker' for your Far Seer. They also babysit objective markers. Every once in a while, they land some good hits on some clumped up chumps and do some work. If that is all you expect from them, you'll never be disappointed.

Vibro-Cannons: "Why are these rules still so bad?"
Vibro-Cannons used to be interesting (4th ed. Codex and maybe before that). They've been disappointing, and virtually unplayable, since they were re-thought in the 6th ed. Codex. The fact that the example of the effects of multiple hits from the same unit goes up to S10 and down to AP1...when the unit has a maximum of 3 a glaring example of Dumb. So, if you hit with everything, you get 3 LasCannons. That's not bad. But if you miss with one, you get two Krak missiles...for 90 Points. Odds are, you miss with one. So if you're willing to poke at things with Krak missiles, go right ahead. IMO, these should have been re-imagined as operating like Grav weapons (for fluffy-ish reasons, not because I think Eldar need one more thing...).

Another thing to understand about Vibro-Cannons is that they are NOT Barrage; each gun AND one crewman for each gun BOTH need to have Line of Sight to the target. I play a guy that uses Rapier Laser Destroyers, and I don't call him on the fact that it's often the case that they don't all have LoS. I'm usually winning anyway. However, it is the rule, and it makes them even less desirable.

Distortion Cannons: "Yes, please!"
I've put these in lists and taken them out several times already. The extra 75 points it costs to field them usually comes out of upgrades on other units. There is no denying their impact as an Area Denial unit. They also draw a lot of attention and/or smart players just play around them (Invisibility, for example).

D-Cannons are Barrage weapons, but have only a 24" range. If there was ANY way to get a Relentless character into that unit...I'd have no friends left! :( So, when it comes to deployment, they need to be fairly central. I've tried putting them in the backfield, but that makes it too easy to play around them.

How Do I Do the D?
I've seen questions about how to resolve attacks from Distortion Cannons (or other template based Strength D attacks). Here's how it works for Distortion Cannons:

1) Measure from the closest gun (even if it is NOT a gun with LoS, the closest gun is ALWAYS used to resolve the initial placement). Remember that both the CLOSEST gun, and a crewman within 2" of that gun, have to have LoS to the target in order to reduce scatter.
2) Resolve scatter for the initial small blast template.
3) Count the number of models wholly, or partially, under the template. That is the number of Hits for the first template.
4) Roll the scatter die to 'flip' the last two templates. A 'Hit' result on the Scatter Die allows you to place the small blast template ANYWHERE so long as it touches one of the previously placed templates (including overlapping partially or totally). Otherwise, the small blast template flips, from the INITIAL template, in the direction indicated by the arrow.
5) Count the number of additional Hits generated by the subsequent templates.
6) At this point, instead of Rolling to Wound, you roll on the D-Chart, once for each Hit.
7) Having generated two types of results ("Sixes" and "Not-Sixes"), you may have your opponent resolve either set first, assigning them as if the shooting attack originated from the center hole of the first template. "Not-Sixes" allow for Cover or Invulnerable Saves to be taken.

So, should you take artillery? Absolutely yes. Even in my Combined Arms Detachment lists, I will at least take a unit of Shadow Weavers. While a mobile Far Seer is definitely asset, it is hard to beat putting him in a T7 unit. And, the utility is mutual--he brings high leadership and psychic defense to the table.

Back to the Insights Index:

Discussion: THE LIST / 1850 Tau Empire/Firebase Cadre/Imperial Knight
« on: June 27, 2015, 02:33:59 PM »
Since my Tau 'Knight' is built, I've put together a list. I look forward to your thoughtful comments:

Tau Empire/Firebase Cadre/Imperial Knight

Combined Arms Detachment: Tau Empire
HQ: Buff Commander (162)
  o Command and Control Node, Multi-Spectrum Sensor Suite, Iridium Battlesuit, Stimulant Injector, Neuroweb System Jammer
TROOP 1: 6 Fire Warriors (54)
TROOP 2: 6 Fire Warriors (54)
ELITE 1: 2 Crisis Suits (84)
  o 4 Burst Cannons
ELITE 2: 2 Crisis Suits (109)
  o 4 Fusion Blasters, Target Lock (x1)
ELITE 3: Riptide (245)
  o Stimulant Injector, Twin-Linked Fusion Blasters, Ion Accelerator, Early Warning Override, Velocity Tracker

Formation: Firebase Support Cadre [Tank Hunters, Preferred Enemy: Space Marines]
Riptide (220)
  o Stimulant Injector, Twin-Linked Fusion Blasters, Heavy Burst Cannon, Early Warning Override
3 Broadsides (282)
  o High-Yield Missile Pods, Twin-Linked SMS, Early Warning Override (x3)
  o 6 Missile Drones
3 Broadsides (210)
  o Heavy Rail Rifles, Twin-Linked SMS, Early Warning Override (x3)

Oathsworn Detachment: Imperial Knight
Knight Crusader (430)
  o Rapid-Fire Battle Cannon, Avenger Gatling Cannon, Heavy Stubber (x2), Heavy Flamer
Link to WiP of the 'Knight':


In theory, the two units of Broadsides deploy close enough so that the Buffmander can jump from the Missile-sides to the Rail Gun unit. I would prefer if the Rail Guns were S9, but c'est la vie, enh? Still, they are S8 and AP1, so they have to be respected.

Discussion: Conversions / Tau 'Knight' Conversion WiP
« on: June 20, 2015, 10:44:53 AM »
Here's a link to my latest efforts at building an Imperial Knight for my Tau:

Discussion: Eldar / 7th Edition Eldar Insights #Warp Spiders
« on: May 26, 2015, 08:43:46 PM »
I wanted Warp Spiders for SOOOOO long (skipped 5th and didn't have any before I stopped playing in 4th), but didn't want Failcast. So I held out (even offered to buy a guy's unpainted, clearly underappreciated, spiders in the middle of a tournament game once--well, offered to by them after the tournament was over) until I could get metal, sweet, sweet metal. And now my Warp Spiders are all chipped up but very much loved. In my first games with them, I don't think they killed a thing. I mis-happed them more often than not, or dropped them in against targets they couldn't actually finish off. With time, and practice, I got to where I can't wait for turn two when my spiders come on and do their thing.

What have they lost?
Monofilament no longer goes to S7 versus low/no Initiative models. Monofilament is no longer AP1 (not that it ever mattered that I can tell; it was only AP1 versus models with a toughness value). That's pretty much it.

What have they gained?
Warp Spiders lose a man to the warp only on Snake Eyes. So jump 18 guilt-free inches, my friends, because you didn't kill anyone to get it done.

Monofilament now rolls to wound versus a model's Initiative (is S6 versus vehicles). This is hard to categorize as a gain or a loss. I guess it's just a change, a change that profoundly affects their utility, effectively removing them from the role of anti-AV12 (preventing them from engaging AV13 entirely) but making them absolutely punishing when used on multi-wound, low-initiative models (read: 'Nid gribblies, Riptides, Tomb Spyders, etc.). The change also introduces some radical inconsistencies compared to their previous incarnation. For example: 6th ed. Warp Spiders wounded Wraith Knights on 6s. 7th ed. Warp Spiders wound Wraith Knights on 3s--THREES! 6th ed. Warp Spiders wounded Daemon Princes (unbuffed) on 3s.  7th ed. Warp Spiders wound Daemon Princes on 6s--SIXES! They can't even touch an I10 model. We got better at killing our own stuff. Good job!

They also gained a 2-wound Exarch with the Eldar version of, 'And They Shall Know No Rules'. And, to put a cherry on this Warp Spider Sundae, they gained Flickerjump. We'll discuss that one later. :)

Should I take an Exarch? And should I spend the points on Power Blades? What about the Spinneret Rifle?
A Warp Spider Exarch is no longer an afterthought. It brings incredible perks to the unit for a mere 10 points. If you don't take one, you'd better have a good reason, or you'll be the rightful subject of ridicule and scorn (or scorn and ridicule, the order doesn't matter). The 10 points gets you: 1. An extra wound; that puts it on par with Librarians, Chaos Sorcerers and other 2-wound HQ models! This, in itself, is remarkable. 2. BS5 WS5 I6 and 2 attacks base; nothing to see here. 3. The 'Iron Resolve' special rule, which allows the unit to AUTOMATICALLY pass Pinning, Fear, Regroup and Morale checks (so long as the Exarch is alive, of course). This means that, unless you're worried about getting COMPLETELY obliterated in assault, you can go in (keep your Exarch 'safe' if need be, you know what I mean) and be confident of getting to Hit and Run when you need/want to.

As for the Power Blades, I think they're a wargear option worth considering now, for two main reasons: First, the Exarch is a 2-wound character that will get 4 attacks on the charge, at WS5, when equipped with Power Blades. Second, I think the Warp Spiders' battle-field role has changed to Skirmisher, which means they'll see an assault at least once a game. And if they're going to be in assault, they should bring something to the party that has to be accounted for (if not respected).

Spinneret Rifle Opinion, UPDATED and REVISED August 11, 2015 The Spinneret Rifle, which is Rapid Fire, S6, Monofilament AND AP1, is only 'really' effective at 9" or less. That's a bit close if you're not planning to end up in assault. It IS possible to Rapid Fire and still assault, since the spiders are Relentless. I'm not sure I will be using them myself, because I either want to be in assault, or be really hard to assault, not somewhere in between. Many thanks to UnorthodoxSoul for pointing out that Jet Pack Infantry have Relentless.

What's the optimal size?
Your mileage will vary. In 6th ed., my personal choice was a unit of 7 or 8. With the perks brought by the Exarch, they will stay on the board until he's gone, so you might be able to make 5 work. However, 10 shots is a bit meh compared to 14 (or 16!). I prefer for them to be able to remove a target by themselves, since they often operate on their own, without direct support from my other units, so I'll stay with 7 or 8.

How should they be used?
Warp Spiders are now firmly cast in the role of Skirmisher. Now that their role is more clearly defined (what COULDN'T they do in 6th ed.?), I can say that they are the best, bar none, skirmishing unit in the game. They not only retained their mobility, they expanded the ways in which they can use their mobility to shape and react to changes on the battlefield. Being a very high priority target, they should default to being kept in Deep Strike reserves. Oh, and you should know this, but if you don't: Be conservative when choosing your Deep Strike location. Warp Spiders have 12" guns, Battle Focus, and Fleet--you don't have to necessarily drop them Danger Close.

Their primary targets should be high-toughness, low-initiative models. I recently put 14 wounds (from 16 shots at BS5/6) on a Riptide, stripping three wounds off of it. Since Warp Spiders wound the vast majority of models on 2s, they should be matched up with units that they can either bring down with VoF (because of how well it translates into wounds) or that they can finish off with a quick assault. I don't recommend assaulting the high-toughness targets. :) They certainly don't have to be dropped off into a corner somewhere either. Putting them near a heavy transport you plan to crack with a different unit is Warp Spider 101, as is dropping them where they can assist with 'guaranteeing' that a specific unit be removed.

When moving them, they should be kept near ruins or other thin, LoS blocking pieces of terrain that they can reliably Jet Pack over (or Flickerjump to the other side of). The risk of losing models to Dangerous Terrain is off-set by keeping them safe from enemy shooting. And, they won't break (unless the Exarch breaks his ankle, amirite?).

Also: Warp Spiders should be part of an Aspect Host whenever possible. The only reason not to is if your list doesn't have enough Aspect Warriors to fill out the 3-unit requirement.

How about that Flickerjump?
DISCLAIMER: Flickerjump, when I first looked at it, appeared to offer INFINITE jumps (and infinite opportunities to lose even more friends than merely holding the new codex has already cost me). I have since looked more closely at it, and am confident that Flickerjump can only be performed ONCE during a turn. I will present my reasoning, but will not debate it here. I will gladly debate it in a different thread in the appropriate forum.

How Flickerjump Works (all on p188 of my interactive Ipad version): 1. Flickerjump is 'activated' (becomes an option) whenever the unit of Warp Spiders (we'll use a specific unit, rather than a generic unit) is chosen as the target of a shooting attack. 2. Having been targeted, the unit "can immediately make a Warp Jump" [my capitalization on 'Jump', sorry--expressive writer here], except that it only goes 2D6" instead of 2D6+6".

If we stop now, Warp Spiders can jump from here to infinity...and beyond. However, we ask, 'How does Warp Jump work?' (because Flickerjump IS a Warp Jump) which leads us to: 3. "If making a Warp Jump, the model immediately moves up to 2D6+6" in any direction (roll once per unit each turn)...". The key here is the limitation, 'roll once per unit each turn'. 'Turn', as we know, always means Player Turn. So, we can roll once for Warp Jump (2D6+6") in our Player Turn. Flickerjump allows us to make a limited Warp Jump (2D6") but is NOT limited to our opponent's Player Turn, it is limited by whether or not we have already performed a Warp Jump in that turn. We do not have permission to roll the dice more than once, and without rolling dice...we go nowhere. So, the 'Infinite Flickerjump' gets stuck on #2 and is therefore unable to complete the action.

How to use Flickerjump: Step One--Paint tiny Trollface memes on your Warp Spiders. Step Two--Provided you did NOT Warp Jump during your turn, declare an assault against a Tau Gunline and then Flickerjump around a corner when they decide to Overwatch. Step Three--Profit. Or, and this is really the most obvious one: If you get a poor Jet Pack roll, use Flickerjump to get out of LoS (or into cover). You are still Jet Pack infantry, so you can either walk or use the pack in the following turn--better to be hobbled for a turn than shot off the table. Finally (Trollfaces already on), Flickerjump away from Psychic Shriek (or any other Witchfire) during your opponent's Psychic Phase. Boom! Denied without using deny dice! Bwahahahaha! (Yeah, I did that--but then I let the guy take it back since it was just too much.)


Attached: Pic of my Warptrolls/Trollspiders

Discussion: Eldar / 7th Edition Eldar Insights: The Wraith Knight
« on: May 12, 2015, 02:25:52 PM »
First things first: The Wraith Knight (I may use this and 'Wraithknight' interchangeably; sorry) is no longer a Heavy Support choice, it is a Lord of War.

Another first: The Wraith Knight is the first 'Jump' Gargantuan Creature (that I am aware of, feel free to correct me). This additional feature--allowing the Wraith Knight the option to Deep Strike--will become critical to proper utilization of this unit in the 7th edition codex.

So...what does it cost?
Stock (with any of 3 different weapon packages), the Wraith Knight is just a titch less than 300 points. When compared to Imperial Knights, this is appallingly, inarguably undercosted for what you get, even BEFORE considering the weapon packages: T8, 3+ Armor, 6 Wounds, 5+ FNP, Stomp, Jump (Deep Strike), 5 S10 AP2 attacks at I5 on the charge. Given that you ALSO get either a Strength D (Mastercrafted) sword that swings at I5 coupled with a 5++ with the potential to Blind enemy units, or you get a pair of Heavy Wraith Cannons that fire Strength D 36" (and at different targets, if you wish), the Wraith Knight is clearly undercosted. You'll notice I didn't include the Suncannon. At this time, I do not consider the Suncannon/Scattershield to maximize the Wraith Knight's new status, or fill a Role not adequately filled by something else.

How durable is it?
With Heavy Wraith Cannons, without cover (or in cover, but then we'll just assume it was being shot at with Ignores Cover anyway, since that is more efficient and we should assume an intelligent opponent), the Wraith Knight is ~33% more survivable than it used to be. For example, LasCannons (BS3 with Monster Hunter) used to require ~20 shots to meet the statistical threshold for removing a Wraith Knight. Now they require ~26 shots. This is approximate mathhammer. If it's significantly off, please let me know. Versus Poison attacks, the Wraith Knight is virtually impervious (24 hits produce just 4 wounds, none of which is likely to make it through both the 3+ armor and 5+ FNP. Wraith Knights ARE, however, vulnerable to 'exploding wound' effects like the one the Skitarii employ (To Wound rolls of '6' automatically do an additional wound, regardless of the targets Toughness). Attacks with the Instant Death special rule are the best way to put down a Wraith Knight, both because they do additional wounds and because FNP cannot be taken against them. Question: Can FNP be taken against the 'extra' wounds caused by an Instant Death attack?

With the Sword & Board, it would take ~36 shots from those same LasCannons!

What Role(s) does it fill and how should it be armed?
The Wraith Knight, regardless of loadout, should be used to shape your opponent's deployment, influence your opponent's reserves placement (Deep Strike, Outflank, etc.), and destroy the elements of your opponent's army that are the greatest threat to the REST of your army. Sometimes, the elements that are the greatest threat to the rest of your army will also be the greatest threat to the Wraith Knight itself. In that case, it should be simple to decide what to send the Wraith Knight after. However, if your opponent has a Land Raider Redeemer (AP3 Flamers) and a Knight Lancer (serious threat to your Wraith Knight in assault) and you have lots of Jetbikes (yeah, I'm still going to call them Jetbikes; sorry), then you should make sure the Redeemer is dealt with before turning your attention to the Lancer. Wraith knights won't win you games by being the last model on the board, they will win you games because they cannot be stopped before they neuter your opponent's army.

As for how it should be armed: If you're only taking one, it should have 2 Heavy Wraith Cannons. If you're taking two, the second one can be Sword & Board (most useful if you live in the land of Imperial Knights and Draigo and Bloodthirsters and so on). You have the option to add 1 or 2 Heavy Weapons (Shuriken Cannons, Scatter Lasers, Star Cannons), with Star Cannons being the most expensive. I think dual Scatter Lasers will be the standard compliment to the Heavy Wraith Cannons, with Star Cannons making an appearance now and again (certainly something to consider when you have ~10 points to spend).

How many should I take?
You should never take more than 2 (you want to keep SOME of your friends, right?), because it isn't necessary and you can spend those ~300 points on other things. Most of the time, you should take 1. I plan to take mine as part of a CaD because the Craftworld Warhost doesn't seem worth it (the Aspect Host formation will be the formation most used by Eldar players, the Crimson Death formation may be the most used overall, what with CtA allies and all).

How should it be deployed?
Keeping in mind that the primary purpose of including a Wraith Knight in your army is to shape your opponent's deployment and reserves placement, the Wraith Knight should be deployed so that your opponent cannot shoot his entire army at it, and with access to a cover save. This means you should deploy on one flank, or further back in your DZ, or out of LoS (if you have the luxury of playing with THAT kind of terrain!), or perhaps hold your Wraith Knight in Reserves (to either walk on or Deep Strike).

Do not underestimate the value of keeping your Wraith Knight in reserves. Several of the most dangerous lists are shaped around Alpha Strikes. But you can't kill what isn't there so...your opponent's Stern Guard will pile out of their (solo) drop pod and look dumb (or waste their Surprise, Plasma! on a less desirable target). The same goes for an Alpha Strike built around psykers.

Now, if your reserves will come in on a long board edge, feel free to have your Wraith Knight walk on. If you want to have a (better) chance at an Alpha Strike (are these things called Beta Strikes if they happen on Turn Two?), then consider using Deep Strike.

How should it be supported?
Other than bubble-wrapping it (which I don't recommend), I think the best way to support your Wraith Knight will be accomplished either by taking other units with high threat-profiles (I have Hornets with Pulse lasers, for example) or putting it in Reserves. I think Jetbike spam (more than 3x3 units is my working definition of 'Jetbike spam') is a trap. From my perspective, there are too many targets that jetbikes cannot engage effectively (or efficiently).

What about that D, tho?
If, where you play, you feel like Ranged D is too much, by all means feel free to House Rule it. However, please consider trying the following things first: 1) Increase the quality (if not the quantity) of the terrain you play with. 2) Increase player interaction with terrain by dicing off and alternating placing pieces BEFORE determining Deployment Zones. 3) Play missions with more depth than just, 'Let's see who can shoot whose army off the board'. Maelstrom (using the AdeptiCon version) is very playable. It also forces people to reconsider (and diversify) their lists if they want to compete in a Maelstrom environment. 4) Play with the (very reasonable) limitation of one Lord of War per list. The Strength D shooting available to the Wraith Guard is an absolute nightmare for a low-model-count, meched-up list, but will get roflstomped by MSU or Horde.

Starting in the Spring of 2014, I got a number of games (around 20, in casual, tournament practice, and actual tournament games) against Lords of War (and Super Heavy Walkers--you know what I'm talking about) while trying to settle on a list that wasn't 5 Wave Serpents and 3 Wraith Knights. While learning not to fear D (or Lords of War), I learned that player-placed terrain was the single most important factor in whether or not I could compete with a list. I think you'll find the same thing.

If you DO decide to House Rule your D, consider using the following profile for the D Chart: 1 = Nothing. 2-5 = D3 Wounds/Hull Points and a roll on the Pen Chart (@AP2). 6 = D3+1 Wounds/Hull Points and a roll on the Pen Chart (@AP2), No Saves of Any Kind. Wounds resolved at S10 for purposes of Instant Death.

How will I run my Wraith Knight(s)?
I plan to run my Wraith Knight with dual Heavy Wraith Cannons and dual Scatter Lasers, taken as part of a CaD. I will put it in Reserves as often as not, and I will focus on maximizing its use as a board control unit.

P.S. Gargantuan Creatures can fire every weapon they are equipped with, and fire them at different targets if they wish. If you don't agree with this, please post your disagreement in a different thread. I won't entertain those arguments here.

While Saim-Hann players' hearts leapt at the sight of the Windrider Host, mine was gladdened by the Guardian Battlehost.

Formation Contents: In order to use this formation, you must have a Farseer, 3 units of Guardians, at least 1 Vyper, at least 1 War Walker, and at least 1 Support Battery. Optional is a Warlock Conclave.

Perk One: The Guardians from this formation get 1 free Weapon Platform per unit. If you take a 20-man unit and want a second platform, you will have to pay for it. Some people are looking immediately at the Eldar Missile Launcher (because it is so expensive), but I expect Star Cannons or Bright Lances to win out as having the greatest complimentary utility.

Perk Two: The Vyper(s), War Walker(s) and Support Battery have Preferred Enemy when SHOOTING at a unit that is within 12" of one of the units of Guardians from this formation. I think, on the whole, that this perk is superior to what the Windrider host gets. You can either use it defensively to hit harder as your opponent gets closer, or you can use it aggressively by pushing your Guardians forward to threaten targets farther away. When you are fielding S6 (or better) weapons, you wound most things on 2's. Re-rolling 1's is phenomenal. The Windrider Host perk suffers from being tied to the Farseer, and is limited by only being once per game. The Guardian Battlehost perk is in effect from turn one, and lasts, for all practical purposes, as long as the formation lasts, rather than depending on the longevity of a single, high-priority target.

Perk Three (Situational): Taking the Guardian Battlehost unlocks the option to create a Craftworld Warhost. In order to completely unlock the Craftworld Warhost, you must take at least one of seven (7) 'Auxiliary' formations. If you do, every unit in the Detachment will automatically get to run up to 6". For the only codex with widespread access to Battle Focus (or an ability like it), this is a significant benefit. I have lost War Walkers by failing to get a sufficient run move to duck back into ruins. I have left my units (more) vulnerable to assault by failing to fall back far enough. I have lost games by failing to run far enough to capture or contest an objective.

Minimal Cost: Barebones, this formation comes in at 500 points (the barebones Stormhost comes in at 446 and the Windrider Host comes in at 358). So, it's not the cheapest way to unlock 1-12 Wraith Knights. However, it is worth the extra points. The Stormhost needs transports to be most effective (Dark Eldar Raiders look good for them), and the min-sized Windrider host is 12 while it is the cheapest, it is also the easiest to shoot off the table. I have fit a min-sized Guardian Battlehost into an 1850 list with a Wraith Host (automatic 6" Battle Focus for ALL Wraith) AND a Dark Eldar Combined Arms Detachment (2 Webway Portals and 10 total warriors). The list is by no means competitive (at the highest levels), but it will certainly provide a new flavor of the rainbow for your opponents to taste. My point is that I am not going to dismiss taking a min-sized Battlehost. While it loses almost all of its internal power (Prefered Enemy is relatively pointless when you've only got 1 Vyper and 1 War Walker and 1 Shadow Weaver), it can certainly increase the utility of some of the Auxiliary formations.

Optimal Loadout: Unit by unit.

Guardians: 10-man units. Or 2 10-man units and 1 20-man unit (if you don't want to put the Far Seer with the Support Battery). Which platform depends on what you plan to load your Vyper(s) and War Walker(s) with, as well as what you will use to fill out the remaining ~1350 points. I'm thinking Star Cannons or Bright Lances. Should you take the Warlock upgrade? I don't think you'll regret it, but if you're not angling towards a psychically dominant list, or if you're tight for points, then you can pass on them. Should you take Wave Serpents? If you plan to play your Guardians defensively (behind an Aegis, bought by a CaD, for example), if you plan to play a complete Footdar list or if you are tight on points, then no. Otherwise: Yes. The Wave Serpent was nerfed from being the most survivable, mobile gunboat in the game to 'merely' being the best, most survivable transport in the game. Some nerf. /eyeroll

War Walkers: While I originally planned to run my War Walkers with EML, I've seen some Math Hammer that has me thinking Scatter Lasers will be the right loadout. Bonus: Switching between Shuriken Cannons and Scatter Lasers is FREE for War Walkers. Star Engines are expensive, but that is a guaranteed 9" Battle Focus if you go for the Craftworld Warhost option. Something to think about.

Vypers: I don't like Vypers. I never have. I have one painted. The first time I put it on the table, Space Marines shot it to death with their Bolt Guns. Forget that. I shelved it and haven't played a Vyper since. Vypers still aren't actually GOOD, but they are 10 points cheaper. That means for 150 points, you can put 6 Shuriken Cannons on the table. /shrug I plan to just run one Vyper, but I will give it that second Shuriken Cannon. Star Cannons might be good on these as well.

Support Battery: Calling these things, "Vaul's Wrath Support Battery" is ridiculous. Come up with a better, shorter name, please. As in the last codex, it's either Shadow Weavers or D-Cannons. Remember that Destroyer Weapons do not make 'To Wound' rolls, they roll on the Destroyer Table. That means Preferred Enemy will not make them better. That being the case, Shadow Weavers are my choice. I should note, however, that Webstriking ('Webstriking' = Using a Dark Eldar HQ with a Webway Portal to Zero-Scatter Deep Strike) some D-Cannons into an optimal position, even though you'll have to wait until turn 3 to fire them, is just about as weird a thought as using Infiltrate shenanigans used to be. Should you take the Warlock upgrade? If you're planning to put your Farseer with the unit, then yes, you should. It gives you a character to take challenges with (assault being the most reliable anti-artillery there is) and gives you access to +1/-1 armor or Shrouded or Fearless.

Farseer: If you don't take the Spirit Stone of Anath'lan for your Farseer, you're doing it wrong. Depending on how the rest of your army fills out, you can put him on a bike (and join him to a JetCouncil), put him with allied Dark Eldar in one of their delicate open-topped transports, stick him with the Shadow Weavers (who's T7 NOW?), or put him in a Guardian Brick and roll for a 4++ (and Fortune if you're that kind of lucky).

Warlock Conclave: I don't think filling out a conclave is a good idea in the Guardian Battlehost, particularly if you're taking the Warlock upgrades for the Guardians and the Shadow Weavers. If you want a Seer Council, take one. You can always join the Farseer from this formation to that one. I'm happy to entertain arguments for including one, I just can't see its value myself (right now).

My 'Standard' Loadout: Farseer (Spirit Stone of Anath'lan). 3x10 Guardians with Bright Lance Weapon Platforms. 1 Vyper (Dual Shuriken Cannons). 3 War Walkers (Scatter Lasers). 3 Shadow Weavers (Warlock). This comes in at 740 points total, leaving 1110 points for other units. Granted, I have not maximized the utility of the Vypers, but that's a personal quirk. Overall, this formation is reasonably self-sufficient.

Most Complimentary Auxiliary Choices: Graded Formation by Formation.
Outcasts: Not to be overlooked since they acquired 'Shrouded'. For 60 points, they won't do too much more than camp an objective, but they'll do that pretty well so long as they can Go to Ground for 2+ cover saves. If you plan to play your Battlehost aggressively and need something to camp a backfield objective, these guys can do it cheap. Grade: C+

Aspect Host: An Eldar list that doesn't include an Aspect Host is going to end up being regarded as 'weak'. +1BS or +1WS on top of the benefits of buying Exarchs is too good to pass up. This formation belongs in every Eldar list, no matter what else is in it. Grade: A+

Dire Avenger Shrine: This formation is interesting, but since it isn't mandatory, I don't see it being taken as part of a Craftworld Warhost. As such, and because it duplicates the Bladestorm ability already brought to the table by Guardians, Dire Avengers are not a good compliment. Grade: C-

Wraith Host: Combining a Guardian Battlehost with a Wraith Host might be a trap. Sure does sound good, and I plan to play it at least a few times, but it backs up the 'core' with a low-count (minimal) list of 18 models. Still, that's 17 Strength D shots at 5 different targets so.... Grade (for now): B- (Can't ignore the Wraith Knight and the Strength D)

Crimson Death: This is a good compliment. Similarly to the Aspect Host, this formation will likely end up in every Eldar list (as well as lots of not-Eldar lists). The formation perks are really good. Given just a little bit of luck (versus Tyranid), the Crimson Death formation will establish total dominance. Drawbacks are that they are still AV10 and they are expensive (430 points). But, they definitely cover a (potential) weakness in the Guardian Battlehost (lack of anti-air). Grade: A-

Engines of Vaul: Night Spinners look to be broken (as in: their rules seem like they break the game), Fire Prisms are back to buffing each other's shots (/shrug) and Falcons get to Zero-Scatter Deep Strike IF you take a Squadron of three (3). I honestly don't know which way to go with these units. Engines of Vaul is not an independent formation, so it doesn't exist outside of a Craftworld Warhost. I think Night Spinners are the overall winner (3 S9, Barrage, Large Blasts with the Monofilament rule is...nuts), followed by Falcons IF taken in a squadron of 3, otherwise Fire Prisms edge them out. I suppose that if you are going to mech up your Guardians, or if you're taking the Aspect Host to support your Guardians, you might consider this formation. Grade (for now): C+

Wraith-Constructs: The Wraithlord got no love. Leave him on the shelf unless you're paying the Wraith Host tax. The Hemlock, while spitting out wildly inefficient Strength D-Lite blasts, is a psyker to be reckoned with, and feared. A pair of these could soften up your opponent as you rush your Guardians forward. I don't own any right now, but I think I will very soon. The Wraith Knight should pass without comment. That is all. Grades: Wraith Lord C-, Hemlock A- (-1 to the Destroyer Table...), Wraith Knight A+

My last game with the 6th edition codex:

I have a couple of thoughts on the codex:

1. The Warlock Conclave tax on the Windrider Host may be too much for me to pay, it should have been optional (as it is in both the Battlehost and Stormhost). The Farseer isn't forced to join it (it isn't a Seer Council), but that leaves me with one Jetlock that cannot join another unit (not an independent character). Shred looks pretty good, but I'll probably field my bikes out of a CAD.
2. The Battlehost formation, minus the Taxvyper, is almost EXACTLY what I used to play. I look forward to fielding it again.
3. Unless there are more Formations than the ones I have access to, Craftworlds are not implemented in the game, just in the fluff. C'est la vie, but I was hoping to get some cool stuff. I will continue to make 'pew pew' noises and pretend my Craftworld is dedicated to recovering artifacts, no matter who they have to kill (and who they have to hire).
4. My Warwalkers will almost certainly be kitted out with EML. Flakk for THAT price? Saweet.
5. I will finish building my third Falcon/Fire Prism/Night Spinner chassis. I'm a big fan of zero-scatter deep strikes. The Fire Prism will not see the table, but the Night Spinner squadron looks like pure murder.
6. Running Dark Eldar as my Primary CAD for Webway Portals and Fast Attack Raiders to pair up with the Wraithhost formation makes me feel real, real dirty. Real dirty.
7. Being able to either take Dire Avengers in the Shrine OR the Aspect Host makes them extra special. The fact that they keep their, "Hmmm, do I overwatch at BS2 or get Counterattack and Stubborn?" rule is fantastic. They are vastly superior to their previous incarnation, clearly standing head-and-shoulders above mere Guardians.
8. I will gladly pay 50 points to field ONE Taxvyper carrying a pair of Shuriken Cannons. Good luck getting me to field more.
9. The Spirit Stone is ridiculous--unless I'm mistaken, it works on every power the Psyker attempts to manifest, not just once per turn.
10. I may get Trollface decals made for the backs of my Warp Spiders. RaW, they can Flickerjump EVERY TIME they are made the target of a shooting attack (as opposed to 'once per turn'). I no longer believe this to be true. Please see my post on Warp Spiders, here:
11. Wraithlords are S9 in combat with the Ghostglaive! POW!

I'll expand this list after I get the full codex (rather than the abbreviated one I have right now).

12. Oh yeah: 'Assured Destruction' for Fire Dragons!? Holy Moley that's +3 on the Pen chart! Everything they touch will blow up, and Super Heavy whatevers will cry salty tears of additional D3 Hull Points worth of damage....

Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 7