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Messages - mcphro

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1
Absolutey.... good job dude.

One of the considerations ive often thought about is the cost to by x weapon platform vs cost/ survivability of said platform (I note any unit is a platform).

An example is a Missile launcher. Given the Eldar circumstances nowdays, I think the Eldar missile launcher is one of our more versitile weapon systems given it can fire in 2 modes. It can be antitank, or is can be Anti-infantry.

But there are a number of ways to take that weapon.

Guardian squads
Vypers
War Walkers
Wraithlords
I also include Dark Reaper squads.

etc.

If you wanted to "maximise" the number of Missile weapons in an army, but also have the best survivability, what would be the best option?

6 x Dark reaper squads? + Wave serpents?

***the idea is simply to start shooting at one vehicle till its dead... and move onto the next.

I ask this partially because a) we have taken a hit... and b) in our meta one of the more powerful armies is a Dark Eldar army, and between blasters, Ravagers etc etc It is a very good army and im thinking of ways to counter it. DE Dark lances are assault so with the movement of the vehicle they have 48 inches to shoot. Eldar Bright lances are HEAVY... how unfair is that!

an idea... 2000 points. Basically 2 spearhead detachments:

Warlock
6 x Dark Reapers with a missile launcher for exarch

Warlock
6 x Falcons with Spirit stones.

Notes:
- When deploying you only have 6 models to place... your going first almost always - unless they seize.
- If you go first 5 out or 6 times, then turn one, you get out of the vehicles and you shoot your bum off. If all weapons fire, your looking at:

From Falcons
12 Str 8 Pulse laser shots
6 Str 8 Missile shots

From Dark Reapers
6 Str 8 Missile Shots
12 Str 8 Reaper shots.

An Alpha strike of 36 Str 8 Shots doing either 3 or D6 damage. At BS 3, 24 will hit, vs T7 Vehicles 16 should wound - 10 should get through at least night shields (+5 inv), doing upto 30 ish damage.

Thoughts?




2
Its all good mate.

Cant wait to read it. Until they release SOB in plastic, there will only be a limited number of us SOB players, so the more battle reports and experiences the better.

I know the guys at my club are more than a little annoyed about the Acts of Faith special rule.

There is nothing quite like 4 x heavy bolter SQUADS with imagifiers sitting watching over the battlefield with even celestine nearby. Thats upto 48 free shots and then in the shooting phase another 48 shots at Str 5, AP-1 right into the bad guys. Over 5 turns, a possible 480 shots!

Let the good times roll!

3
How did your tourney go?

4
Discussion: Eldar / Re: Oh my godsh... Harlequins are the bomb!
« on: July 17, 2017, 12:09:31 AM »
Im glad that in my meta, I dont have many knights to face.

Only 1 or 2 single models here and there. I have to say in my last harlequin game, I couldnt believe how well they did.

5
Discussion: Eldar / Re: Oh my godsh... Harlequins are the bomb!
« on: July 16, 2017, 06:01:44 AM »
Ok, how about this list...

Essentially, it's 3 x battalion detachment that is identical and it has 9 Troupes with 5 starweavers. The army is fast, has a 4+ save and each troupe has a mix of embraces and caresses.

It has 6 Troupe masters with fusion guns and caresses, with so many attacks the idea is simply to overwhelm the enemy. Can it deal with 3 x Imperial Knight lists? Dunno, but it does have 12 Command points for those rerolls and I've been doing the numbers and as has been said, the more Caresses available in a squad will help to wound on 5's against those high toughness creatures. Saying that you aren't without fusion pistols hitting on 2's, from all those protected troupe masters and scouts will never wipe them all out (5 riding in star weavers anyway).


Anyway enough talk... check it out.

Harlequin Battalion detachment - 3CP

HQ
----
1 x Troupe master (Fusion pistol, Caress)
1 x Troupe master (Fusion pistol, Caress)

Troups
--------
1 x 5 man troupe (3 caress, 2 embrace)
1 x 5 man troupe (3 caress, 2 embrace)
1 x 5 man troupe (3 caress, 2 embrace)

Dedicated Transports
-------------------------
Starweaver
Starweaver
Starweaver

Harlequin Battalion detachment - 3CP

HQ
----
1 x Troupe master (Fusion pistol, Caress)
1 x Troupe master (Fusion pistol, Caress)

Troups
--------
1 x 5 man troupe (3 caress, 2 embrace)
1 x 5 man troupe (3 caress, 2 embrace)
1 x 5 man troupe (3 caress, 2 embrace)

Dedicated Transports
-------------------------
Starweaver
Starweaver

Harlequin Battalion detachment - 3CP

HQ
----
1 x Troupe master (Fusion pistol, Caress)
1 x Troupe master (Fusion pistol, Caress)

Troups
--------
1 x 5 man troupe (3 caress, 2 embrace)
1 x 5 man troupe (3 caress, 2 embrace)
1 x 5 man troupe (3 caress, 2 embrace)

Notes:
  • 5 x star weavers is your strike force to wrap up 1/2 of their army and put the pressure on
  • Is was a toss up whether a Shadowseer should be in there to aide movement, but this list is about bodies. Each troupe is only 114 points.
  • Can you imagine the troupe masters all ganging up on something? 5 Troup masters vs an imperial knight. They are going first anyway due to low model count, but you have so many units who do they shoot at? They can't shoot the troupe masters, you have them wrapped with your troupes. Who would win, 5-6 troup masters vs an imperial knight?
  • Not counting the troupe masters or vehicles, you only have 180 attacks - all at Str 4,
     -3 AP, 1 dmg, or Str 5, -2 AP, 1 dmg)
  • Obviously if playing for tactical objective missions, you have the bodies and the vehicles to get there and score points.
  • 5 x starweavers with shuriken cannons aren't pushovers anymore either
  • Ok sure, 4 units still have to run on foot. But they are fast, and who do you think they are going to be shooting at? the 5 starweavers shooting at them?
  • Lastly, im sorry i just dont think Skyweavers are worth it. Havent played them too much and im sure poeple will have some amazing stories with them, perhaps im wrong. But for only 3 attacks each id rather have extra bodies in this list. On average the 4 troupes will still be moving up the field 12" a turn... and as soon as they get close enough, those legendary charges with 12 reroll chances will help them get into combat.

There isnt any restrictions running the same detachments is there?
Thoughts?

6
Discussion: Eldar / Re: Oh my godsh... Harlequins are the bomb!
« on: July 12, 2017, 11:58:34 PM »
I agree wholey about flamers. You must charge in with the starweaver first. Otherwise i was yea it wouldnt be pretty. But with 7 starweavers charging across the field focussing on half their army i wouldnt like to have to stop that at all.


7
Discussion: Eldar / Oh my godsh... Harlequins are the bomb!
« on: July 12, 2017, 09:47:06 AM »
Ok my quick review of harlis playing with them... HELL YES!

My last game I took harlies with fusion pistols and caresses. 30pts a model is very expensive. But i found out, ALWAYS put them in a starweaver.. .always. But I can tell you I pulled off some amazing charges.

My Solitaire charged a 22" charge out of a vehicle... and murdered an opposing character, It was glorious!

I could be wrong, but I dont like sky weavers. only 3 attacks each isnt that much for what they are worth. I found in a 2000 point game, this is what id take. Keep it really easy and simple. The list may seem boring, but wow will it do damage.

Battalion formation +3 CP
HQ
1 x troupemaster (embrace, fusion pistol)
1 x troupemaster (embrace, fusion pistol)

Troupes
5 x harlies (5 embraces, 2 fusion pistols)
5 x harlies (5 embraces, 2 fusion pistols)
5 x harlies (5 embraces, 2 fusion pistols)
5 x harlies (5 embraces, 2 fusion pistols)

Dedicated transports
Starweaver
Starweaver
Starweaver
Starweaver
Starweaver

Battalion formation +3 CP
HQ
1 x troupemaster (embrace, fusion pistol)
1 x troupemaster (embrace, fusion pistol)

Troupes
5 x harlies (5 embraces, 2 fusion pistols)
5 x harlies (5 embraces, 2 fusion pistols)
5 x harlies (5 embraces, 2 fusion pistols)


Elite
Solitaire

Dedicated transports
Starweaver
Starweaver
Starweaver

Tactics
---------
Are very simple. Charge up the board with your 4+ save... SWAMP 1/2 of their army. You have 7 vehicles which are very resilient and next turn, they all get out and deploy 3", move 8", Then they get to charge ONLY AFTER your starweaver has charged in the first.

I wreaked carnage with only 3 units of harlies doing this. I cant imagine 7 doing it. Very hurty!

8
Cant wait. Did it go ok?

9
Discussion: Sisters Of Battle / MCPHRO - 2000 points
« on: July 10, 2017, 11:10:57 AM »
Ok, I've finally settled on my 2000 points

Spearhead detachment

HQ
-----
Canonness (stormbolter, powermaul)

Elites
--------
1 x imagifiers
1 x imagifiers

Heavy support
------------------
Exorcist with storm bolter
Exorcist with storm bolter
2 x Penitent Engines
2 x Penitent Engines
Retributer squad with 4 heavy bolters
Retributer squad with 4 heavy bolters

Outrider Detachment

HQ
----
Celestine with 2 gemini

Elite
-----
1 x imagifiers
1 x imagifiers

Fast attack
-------------
5 x Seraphim with superior with powersword/ plasma pistol and 2 girls with inferno pistols
5 x Seraphim with superior with powersword/ plasma pistol and 2 girls with inferno pistols
5 x Seraphim with superior with powersword/ plasma pistol and 2 girls with inferno pistols

Heavy support
------------------
Retributer squad with 4 heavy bolters
Retributer squad with 4 heavy bolters
 
Tactics
-----------
Celestone and the searphim always operate as a unit with 6" of her to gain the 5+ rerollable invun save (and 12 inferno shots and 3 plasma shots and combined assault

2 x 2 unit penitient engines squads are EVERYBODy's nightmare and are the "distraction carnifex", who are quite capable of taking down any number of bad guys. Deal with them in your face or reap the assault!

2 exorcists and 4 retibuter squads are the fire support (retributers affected by the imagifiers and the cannonnes for the reroll of 1's to hit and free shooting AOF attack per turn.

Modifications
-----------------
You can lose 2 retributer squads with 2 imagifers to gain a 3rd Penitent egine unit, but buy having more back field units you prevent more deep strike units getting closer and TBH, the retributer squads will put out an intimidating amount of fire, where the engines have to get up close. Either is fine as the engines are everbodies night mare now. Id use hammer and anvil tecniques now. The engines are the hammer and Celistine is the anvil.

10
Below is a reply to an email I received from frontline gaming in regards to Acts of faith and if it was possible to shoot at characters in the Acts of faith (as it was perceived that it wasn't the shooting phase)
-------------------


Frankie Giampapa <frankiegiampapa@gmail.com>

  Reply|
Today, 2:22 AM
You
Hello Roy,

  The sisters shoot as if it were the shooting phase so would not be able to shoot the character.

  You do not receive cover if 1 model is outside of the cover.

Frankie

On Sat, Jul 8, 2017 at 4:32 PM, <contact@frontlinegaming.org> wrote:

Rules and sisters of Battle Question


Question 1 - Sisters of battle attacking characters at will
Is it intentional sisters of battle can attack characters using ACTs of Faith at the start of the turn outside of the shooting phase?.



From the FAQ...
Q. When can I target an enemy Character that has a Wounds characteristic of less than 10? A. Such a Character can only be targeted in the Shooting phase if it is the nearest visible model to the firing model. You can target enemy Characters without restriction in the Psychic phase*, Charge phase, Fight phase, etc. You may also make shooting attacks at enemy Characters which occur outside the Shooting phase (i.e. when resolving Overwatch in the Charge phase). *Note, however, that some psychic powers, such as Smite, do not target units but instead affect the nearest enemy unit.

e.g. Turn 1 - Retributer squad uses an Act of Faith to fire 12 heavy bolter shots at a character in the opposing army within 36" range.

Did retributer squads just become the Sisters of Battle Sniper teams? Buy 3 Retributer squads, 2-3 imagifiers and a cannoness in the Spearhead detachment EVERY time!

is this right?

11
The list I made is a legal Patrol detachment, I did go a bit over kill on the extra acts of faith but the potential for 4 makes a turn where seraphim are out, Celestine doing assault stuff, and than you get the 24 heavy bolter shoots. Or even the battle sister squads if they are up to strength and near enough to hurt something but can get by with less for sure.

Do you know if Celestines act can be used on herself? It seems like you can't but for other characters their aura buffs affect themselves so does hers count too?

Should consider inferno pistols as a anti vehicle option or combi-meltas in my list. Just only thing with inferno pistols is that you can't really deep strike them in for some alpha because of the 6" range but i guess with act of faith they can move 24" a turn so not to huge of a deal but could still make get caught and killed with out doing to much.

I see online people use the act of faith used on herself. Her rules states: "You can pick a friendly Adepta Sororitas unit within 6" of celestine and perform an act of faith with it".  Now under her faction keywords, she does have that Adepta Sororitas keyword.

As for the Imagifiers, the unit that can get the act of faith on a 4+ must be within 6". This means units like seraphim wont be in range of them. It would be better to use them on the Retributers. They arnt bad by any means, and i wonder what an army would look like with 3 retributers and 3 imagifiers... thats a lot of shots.

7th Edition they made it harder to kill tanks. This edition it is even harder again. You need some melta on the table ad Str 5 bolters wont cut it. You maybe facing land raiders. in my last game 12 heavy bolters did 1 wound to a landraider. They have 16 wounds.

Seraphim are great for a few reasons.
1. Celestine can buff their Shield of faith to a 5+ not 6+.
2. Their special ability gives them a rerollable Shield of faith. Great vs large creatures and so forth.
3. Their flamers are now only D3 not D6. Hardly worth it.
4. You still get a plasma pistol from the superior.

So even if you have 2 squads of 5, treat them as 1 squad of 10. 4 Melta shots, 2 plasma shots, 12 Bolter shots. Thats pretty good for a unit that can move 12.

Then if you use your Acts of faith from celestine and your 2+ act of faith, then they move 12" first, then they move 12" in their movement phase and have a 6" pistol range. So can be deployed centrally, and depending if you opponent sticks a unit out by itself, they are going to surprise assault on its bum. You could give them a powersword each for some more bite if you wish, i do.

Always keep celestine within 6" of a seraphim unit so they also tank the wounds unless your getting shot by snipers. another thought too, you could always use an assassin to pop on out and assault the same turn you intend to assault with the seraphim. Adds another unit to the mix, just a thought.

Well good luck on the Tourney dude. Post your list when youve finalised it and let us know how you did.


12
What i got so far for 1k is

HQ
Celestine - 1 gemni
Cannoness - condeemer bolter

Troop
Battles sisters 5 man - flamer, heavy flamer, combi-flamer
Battle sisters 5 man - flamer, heavy flamer, combi-flamer

Fast Attack
Seraphim 10 man - 2 dual hand flamer girls

Elites
Imagifer
Imagifer

Heavy
Retributer 5 man - 4 heavy bolters
Retributer 5 man - 4 heavy bolters

Transports
Immolator - immolator flamer
Immolator - immolator flamer

Kinda just using flamer spam and heavy bolters to mulch infontry and hopefully enough dakka to break vehicles if needed.

Is this an illegal list? Which force org chart are you using. If battalion you need to have 3 troops.

Why go the 2 imagifiers? With this set up you will get upto 4 Acts of faith, but the only units they will affect is the retributers.

1 - 2_ army wide roll each turn
1 - Celestine within 6" auto
1 - 4+ imagifier
1 - 4+ imagifier

You wont need that many acts of faith. How bout this:
---------------------------
Outrider Detachment - 1000 pts
------------------------------------

HQ
Celestine + 1 Gemini

Elite
1 x Imagifier (For the Heavy Bolters)

Fast Attack
Dominion squad (Combi-flamer + 4 flamers)
1 x Seraphim squad (plasma pistol, 2 Inferno pistols)
1 x Seraphim squad (plasma pistol, 2 Inferno pistols)

Heavy Support
Retributer Squad - (4 x Heavy Bolters)
Retributer Squad - (4 x Heavy Bolters)

Dedicated Transports
Immolator - Immolation Flamer
Immolator - Immolation Flamer

Notes:
- The army 2+ AOF and your 4+ imagifier AOF works on the Retributers to give you 24 free shots a turn (target character models first priority, and or first blood opportunities
- 1 Immolator can scout into cover or attack depending on which turn you are going. The squad inside if they get out are all flamers (still get yout 7 x D6 auto hits if you include the vehicle.
- There is a battle sisters squad with 2 flamers and a storm bolter (they are now cheaper so you should be able to buy some for your vehicles, im using battlescribe) that rides in your other immolator following up the Dominions
- 2 Seraphim squads with inferno pistols each and a plasma pistol. This army, you can choose to use Celestines AOF and the Army wide 2+ AOF to position your seraphim and celestine into position as well.

The seraphim squads are important because they get a 5plus rerollable invun shield of faith roll as long as they are near 6'' of celestine. This gives your assaults some reilliance.

Note: Im finding you are more susceptible to moral with larger squads (10 seraphim strong unit) because you tend to loose more models hence the moral modifier is larger (and we are just T3) - just something to think about.


This list you can choose to pour out the bolter fire, manoeuvre the fast attack into position, have the speed with multiple units to pick up objectives

Repressors - I 3D printed my own since I have access to a 3D printer. I even 3D printed my own Penitent Engines.

13
Discussion: Sisters Of Battle / Re: FAQ and sisters
« on: July 03, 2017, 04:45:56 PM »
Yea imagifiers not being able to effect Exorcists really hurts us. Flamers... hmmm disappointing, but with vehicles being tougher to kill I prefer the Str 8 pistols now, especially since they can fire in combat.

But with Celestine, Act of faith - move 12", then they have a 12" move on their own with a 6" threat range = a 30" threat range to vehicles/ MC.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                           

14
Ok I have 3 lists you could have a think about. Just be aware im not the perfect SOB player either, but these are sort of a varient of what I took on the weekend.

Neither are probably going to win you any friends ;-)

Lets get started...

List 1 - Spearhead Detachment - 1000 pts
------------------------------------

HQ
Celestine + 2 Gemini

Fast Attack
Dominion squad (Combi-melta + 4 melta guns)

Heavy Support
Exorcist
Retributor Squad - (Combi-flamer +  2 x Multi-melta + 2 Heavy Flamer)
Retributer Squad - (4 x Heavy Bolters)

Dedicated Transports
Repressor - 2 Heavy Flamers
Repressor - 2 Heavy Flamers

What this list does
  • Celestine is just nasty and will be in EVERY list you every make with SOB - period
  • The Dominion squad is your anti-tank unit - mounted in the repressor is has 5 melta shots, 2 heavy flamers and a storm bolter.
  • The Exorcist is your obvious heavy support - Sometimes you just need 1
  • Ahh the Retributer squad, in this configuration I'd be so tempted to do this with the other Retributer squad- This is mounted in the other repressor. You can fire 6 weapons. The combined fire from this repressor is: 2 multimeltas, 3 combiflamer/ Heavy flamers, 2 heavy flamers and a storm bolter from the transport. - Thats 5 x D6 auto hits from mostly heavy flamers... you know you could take it to 7 flamers in total too if you replaced the multimeltas (evil grin - 7 x D6 Heavy flamer hits at a 31" threat range)
  • Retributer squad - As mentioned in my previous post, this is your character sniper killer.
     As per the latest FAQ and the Designers notes, you can target characters as long as its a shooting attack but NOT in the shooting phase. This means we can use the Act of faith (2+)
     on this squad to target any character not in a transport. 12 Str 5, -1 AP, 1 dmg shots. (Mathhammer - 8 will hit, 5 will wound, prob a few wounds)
  • Strategy: Keep the Repressors together with celestine and concentrate your moves and firepower in the same 1/4 of the board. Trust me, once they see what the Repressors can do, they will be a big enough of a distraction carnifex. That with Celestine beating them up they will have trouble focusing on the Exorcist and the retributer (heavy bolter)s putting outs 24 shots a turn.


MY PREFERENCE
------------------------------------------------------------
List 2 - Outrider Detachment - 1000 pts
------------------------------------

HQ
Celestine + 1 Gemini (also means you can only resurrect 1(

Fast Attack
Dominion squad(Combi-flamer +  2 x melta + 2 Flamer)
Dominion squad (Combi-flamer +  2 x melta + 2 Flamer)
Seraphim squad (plasma pistol, 2 inferno pistols)

Heavy Support
Exorcist

Retributer Squad - (4 x Heavy Bolters)

Dedicated Transports
Repressor - 2 Heavy Flamers
Repressor - 2 Heavy Flamers

What this list does
  • This is a similar list to the above but perhaps a little more balanced 
  • Celestine maybe a little more vulnerable due to only having 1 Gemini, but you need that 50 points where
  • Since you have 2 dominion squads, both repressors can scout forward 12", move 12" and melta/flamer on with 5 x D6 auto hits from flamers/ heavy flamers, 2 x melta shots, and a storm bolter. Keep both vehicles together and focus fire enemy units to death (10 x D6 auto hits anyone) 
  • The Seraphim stay with celestine giving her much needed support in the form of melta and plasma and you can use both acts of faith to superpower the movement from both of these units. Celestine will also give a 5+ Shield of faith that is rerollable too to the seraphim squad.
  • Same story for the Exorcist 
  • Same story for the Retributer squad 
  • Why this list? Simply:  It has more flexability (both repressors can scout forward with the 2 Dominion units (another list you can only do it with 1). It has extra speed for units to take objectives (seraphim) but it can still pull all its shenanigans like the last list too. 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
List 3

Lastly, another option


MY alternate PREFERENCE
------------------------------------------------------------
List 2 - Spearhead Detachment - 1000 pts
------------------------------------

HQ
Celestine + 1 Gemini (also means you can only resurrect 1)

Elite
1 x Imagifier

Fast Attack
Dominion squad(Combi-flamer +  2 x melta + 2 Flamer)
Dominion squad (Combi-flamer +  2 x melta + 2 Flamer)


Heavy Support
Retributer Squad - (4 x Heavy Bolters)
Retributer Squad - (4 x Heavy Bolters)
Retributer Squad - (4 x Heavy Bolters)

Dedicated Transports
Repressor - 2 Heavy Flamers
Repressor - 1 Heavy Flamers, 1 stormbolter (to make points work)


What this list does
  • In this list you loose some anti-tank, but you gain 3 x Retributer squads with heavy bolters as the Heavy support. and an Imagifier. The WHOLE point to taking this list, is to leverage the acts of faith and the imagifer (use command points if its worth it) to pump out so much heavy bolter fire that you will intimidate opponents if they have any infantry at all not protected in a vehicle. Thats 36 shots using acts of faith at 36" Str 5, AP -1, 1 dmg) plus you get to do it all over again (this time using shooting rules in the shooting phase) = 72 shots @ Str 5, Ap -1, 1 Dmg per turn!!!! Over 5 turns, thats a possible 360 shots (half of those can be shot directly at characters using Acts of Faith.
  • The main issue with this list, is, can you deal with the opposing tanks. This is where you need to be smart with the repressors and Celestine to all put pressure on the same pat of the board togather. With combines 4 x melta, 9 x D6 auto flamer his (3 are heavy flamers) and  2 x storm bolters, thats a lot to put out. None of that included Celestine!

Ok, very long winded, but hope it gave you food for though. I just want to take list 3 vs Tyranids hehe.











15
Sure when i get home...

But here is one for starters...

As per thr mew faqs and designers notes

Holy moly.... did u read some of the designers note...

Did i read this right. If you have an ability to shoot 'out of the shooting phase'.. you are allowed to target a character.

Not targeting a character only exists in the shooting phase.

Retributers just became character snipers with 4 x heavy bolters using an act of faith!

It appears you can target characters with a shooting attack as long as it isnt in the shooting phase.

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