Author Topic: Help with 1500p KDK needed!  (Read 1391 times)

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Offline Sensenbob

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Help with 1500p KDK needed!
« on: May 02, 2016, 09:15:41 AM »
Greetings, filthy Heretics! ;)
I have a Friend who recently came back to 40k and plays KDK but with little sucess as of yet, even though our gaming group is quite friendly.
From what i can see as a BloodAngel with no expertise in KDK, it's mainly due do his list consisting of expensive footslogging marine-statlines that don't make it across the Battlefield.
Maybe you can help build a solid list and give ideas for new additions... doesn't have to be uber competitive but improvements need to be made.

Available models afaik:

1 Bloodthirster (any kind).. Warlord & atm. really the only threat in his list.

5 ChaosTerminators
6 Posessed
8 Khone Berzerkers
8 Bloodletters
9 Bloodcrushers

1 Skull Cannon
1 Soul Grinder
1 Forge/Mauler-Fiend

Possibly/hopefully also a DemonPrince, a few Bikers, some Cultists, a Defiler, but i'm not sure on all of these ... (No FleshHounds yet!)

========================================================
- What needs to be added (we allow proxies and can lend him some stuff)
- What would a ok-good 1500p list made mostly from the available models with some additions look like.
- Any relevant uses for Bloodcrushers & Posessed? They frankly seem quite bad.

I'm thinking first of all some Rhinos and 2xMSU Cultists, when that's done maybe work towards Gorepack.... but how to get it all into 1500p?
=Blood Angels=

Offline Draco765

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Re: Help with 1500p KDK needed!
« Reply #1 on: May 02, 2016, 05:15:31 PM »
Posessed are actually very very good once they get into combat. They just lack the amount of mobility to do what they need to do. Fleet helps, Rhino help as well. Lack of a good small Assault transport for the book over all is a let down.

If running CAD: Skull cannon, Soul Grinder(Phlegm Bombardment) and Maulerfiend will be the Heavy Slot fillers.

He does have enough models to field a Blood Host.

Here is a rough draft of a Blood Host at 1346pts, plenty of room to customize the units and add MSU Cultists.

+ Core +

Slaughtercult
Bloodthirster of Unfettered Fury

Berzerkers [7x Bezerkers]
Bezerker Champion [Bolt Pistol, Close Combat Weapon]

Bloodletters [8x Bloodletters]

Possessed [Chaos Rhino, 4x Possessed, Possessed Champion]

+ Auxiliary +

Brazen Onslaught
Bloodcrushers [3x Bloodcrushers]
Bloodcrushers [3x Bloodcrushers]
Chaos Terminators
Terminator [Combi-Bolter]
Terminator [Combi-Bolter]
Terminator Champion [Combi-Bolter]

War Engine
Soul Grinder [Phlegm Bombardment]

War Engine
Maulerfiend [2x Magma Cutters]

Offline Sensenbob

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Re: Help with 1500p KDK needed!
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2016, 08:38:25 AM »
Thanks for your reply, i appreciate it!

Going Blood Host seems like a good start!
The list you posted is quite close to what he fielded given the model restrictions.
My question is more about how to actually customize it and make a well rounded list with good potential from it.

Rhino for Posessed might help.
Maulerfiend should be nice, i like it.

If fielded as it is, i guess it would still be too slow - what about the Zerkers and Bloodletters? Should they just walk?
Bloodcrushers are cool but seem to die from literally anything - mostly getting vaporized by Lascannons - having 2 squads might already help but is it enough without other fast moving elements?

I'm looking for ideas for a cool finished 1500p list because i think my own grasp on the Daemonkin might be lackluster. His personal taste and customisation can be put in afterwards!
(You can put in models that are not mentioned to be present, just don't make the whole list consist of those :D )
Could also use some "how to use" tips for Bloodcrushers, Bloodletters, Berzerkers /Posessed.
Thanks :)
=Blood Angels=

Offline Exalted of the First Host

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Re: Help with 1500p KDK needed!
« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2016, 08:01:47 PM »
MY first two thoughts are a Juggerlord and flesh hounds, amazing, quick melee units. But from what he has I would definitely recommend a list very similar to the one Draco765 gave you. In terms of bloodcrusher tactics, whenever I run them I always deploy in ruins on turn one for the 4+ cover and just rush forward and be scary. If they make it they will do a lot of damage, otherwise they die and leave room for other stuff to get into combat. They are much better in smaller units with more units so I would recommend 3 nits of 3.  Possessed have the most chance inside of a rhino, but keep in mind, with the new FAQ that just got released if the rhino gets destroyed they can't charge out of it unless it was a land raider I.E. assault vehicle. Bloodletters work well as deepstriking objective holders and will scare a lot of other stuff in combat, especially infantry. berzerkers are really hard to play well, I've had some success taking them in a "classic" 40k scenario with no flyers etc.
10 wounds, 10 saves, 10 1's, One epic misfire.

Offline Draco765

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Re: Help with 1500p KDK needed!
« Reply #4 on: May 04, 2016, 10:12:45 PM »
Bloodcrushers: Since you are not slowed by terrain, use it. Rush into combat using terrain as cover, after all once in a fight, Laz cannons can't hit you. Charging through terrain does make your I1 (for sure now with FAQ out), so hop out into the open, survive overwatch and kill them, tr and roll high for consolidate and get back into cover.

Bloodletters: I always Deepstrike them. I use them as my linebreaker and late game back field objective grabbers. if they happen to kill something, all the better. I also use them with the Horn to help pull in other units. Banner is nice to negate scatter on those other units.

Berzerkers: Back field protection or put them in another Rhino and just move them forward and disembark into terrain. You have pistols to weaken a unit after hopping out. Counter attack if they charge you, rage and furious charge if you get to charge. Champion should look at using either an Axe of Khorne or Chain axe. Challenges are extra blood tithes win or lose, good blood tithe management is key to a win.

Posessed: Same as Berzerkers, hop around charge those guys on foot. FYI: Mutations last full game turn, not just the player's. If they are stuck in melee top of turn 2 and bottom of turn 2, they could have two Mutations from the list on them.

Terminators, My favorite build:
Chaos Terminators - Icon of Wrath
2x Combi- Melta, Power Axe
Combi- Flamer, Power Maul
Terminator Champion
Combi- Melta, Power Sword

Deepstriker unit Melta to kill a bothersome vehicle, flamer for later before charging. Icon gives Furious Charge, and may re-roll charge. Melee weapons are mixed so your Sword has a chance of killing at initiative the challenger, Maul for a heaver hit, Axes AP2 at I1.

Used in the formation Terminators and Bloodcrushers get the +1 attack each if outnumbered.


Models not in so far:
Chaos Spawn: 32 point Blood Tithes. They run fast and can be very good in a Maelstrom game grabbing objectives. T5 makes them hard to hurt, but no base save. Put them into the Blood Host and they could have +1 attack and Feel No pain. They also make good Juggerlord (chaos lord on a Juggernaught) body guards since they have the same T5 as him and can move just as fast. 

Flesh Hounds: Scouting 2wounds each that move 12" per turn makes them targets, but gives time for your slower units to catch up and not get targeted. Any back field vehicle that has back armor 10 should fear these. In the formation they gain Hammer of wrath and preferred enemy (Psycker).

Chaos Bikes: Another source of Melta. In the formation Shred on the Hammer of Wrath.

A lot of my base knowledge came from https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000/Tactics/Khorne_Daemonkin%287E%29  and playing it for a few months now.

Offline Sensenbob

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Re: Help with 1500p KDK needed!
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2016, 07:22:16 AM »
Thank you for the input, i was a little too busy for a profound reply lately so it took some time to digest all of this. Based on the suggestions and available models i have put together a "finished" list and would like to get some critique/improvements if possible!
I have read the 1d4chan info too, but its nice to get feedback from people that actually play the army :D
================================================================
+ Core +
Slaughtercult
Bloodthirster of Unfettered Fury (250p)

5x Possessed - no Upgrades (185p)
+ Chaos Rhino DT
8x Bezerkers - 1Chainaxe & Meltabomb on Champion (205p)
+ Chaos Rhino DT
8x Chaos Space Marines - 1 Meltagun (175p)
+ Chaos Rhino DT

+ Auxiliary +
Brazen Onslaught
3x Bloodcrushers (135p)
3x Bloodcrushers (135p)
3x Chaos Terminators - 3x Combi-Melta, 2xPowerAxe, 1PowerSword on Champion (119p)
War Engine
1x Soul Grinder - Phlegm Bombardment (165p)
War Engine
1x Maulerfiend - 2x Magma Cutters (130p)
================================================================

Really having to scrape for points here... would love to Add:
1-2 Spawn, 2x Cultists, 3 more Bloodcrushers, Power Weapons for Champions, Plasma Pistols for Zerkers, Dozer Blades...

Thoughts on the triple Rhino?
Bloodletters can be summoned with BT, so i replaced them with CSM ... expensive tho :(

Flesh Hounds & Bikes are said to be great but it probably will take long for him to get the Hounds (and the models are soooo ugly ^^  DEldar Khymerae might be a nicer proxy )
=Blood Angels=