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Discussion: Grey Knights / Re: New Player needs help
« Last post by Nephran on August 17, 2017, 12:41:33 PM »
Thank you so much for the detailed answer!
It helped me ALOT! I enjoyed reading that wall! ;D

I got my codex and that answered some questions, too! (~I thought I have to give the units those jetpacks for TP-Strike)
It took me some time to get into it and comparing with newly gathered information from your answers and existing insight menu!

"Did I got it right?"
1) "to deepstrike"
Basicly you just move quite instantly deep into enemy lines? [there will be several ways to do so] But GK got teleport strike as _the_ tool for it?
2) Paladin squads:
3man 10 points / 5man 19 points / 10man 32points / 2x5man 38points ? (~>6points for seperated moving)
3) Grandmasters:
You either have a "special" unit which is already a Grandmaster by default, OR you simply "declare" a unit to be your GM for that match?
-> can you have multiple "special" units?
("Vendor told me: If you have "named units", tell your oponent if its ok, some might be overpowered or that he can arrange for what he's facing" - in a non-tournament game)
What confuses me a bit, since my friend got the rulebook and I cannot read the section which probably would explain it;  mcphro listed in his guide the following:
Quote
[...]
HQ
#6 Generic Characters - Techmarine, Brotherhood Champion, Brother Captain/ Grand Master
#7 Named Characters - Brother Captian Stern, Castallan Crowe
#8 Librarian
[...]
Lords of War
#20 Kaldor Drago
[...]
-> Are HQs, GMs, Named Characters, Librarians(?) and Lords of War a different thing (acc. to rules?)


However thanks to all your information I think my first build will look like this (since I already got the pagackes for):

1x Voldus
1x 5Man purger unit (Sry @mcphro, as a vanilla wow player I just tend to purge stuff, likewise with fire ;p)
-> deployed in a Razorback (since they can not tp-strike)
-> Pls check setup below
2x 5man Strike unit
-> Pls check setup below
1x 5man Paladin unit
-> here I need help to build the setup see below.
2x Dread Knight (2x sword, 2x incenerator, 1x psilencer/1xpsicanon)
-> "how can a grandmaster take them?" (At this point; english isn't my mothertongue) -> see above; Did you mean; you simply declare a DK to be your GM?
-> "how do they take a teleporter"?
1x Razorback

-> I can easily expand the list, if you'd suggest me what I'm lacking off!
 
5man Paladin: (option +5?)
Pls help me to assemble the right setup :S
-> how do I create an ancient paladin?
-> how do I create the paragon (as refered in the codex) / in the manual, you always've the option to build terminators or paladins. One terminator gets refered as justicar, its paladin alike is just called "paladin" - is that the paragon? ~>the dude with that skirt-like thing / "tabard"?
-> whats up with the standard bearer? (does bearing a standard make it to an ancient?)
-> so the apothecary can heal... worth taking into a 5man squad (loss of dmg?)
-> same for the staff? worth taking?
...in general I'd be so thankfull for a fully detaild and explained paladin squad example! :S (can also be a 10man - I could imagin, that in a 10man squad it'd be worth having some dmg migitation (staff?!) and healing(apothecary) in the team)

Purger:
i'd give the justicar the hammer
1x incenerator
1x psilencer
2x psicannon
(-> since those are all aviable heavy weapons of the purifier-kit anyway?)
no staff

2x 5man Striker:
2x Justicar with hammer
2x psilencer as heavy option
6x with falchion and bolter

I won't go deep into vehicles just my main issue:

IF I'm having a few vehicles (lets assume 2razors, 1Landraider and one Sormraven -> this means I've 30+ transport slots... to me it's clearly not viable to transport units with teleport strike. having that many purgers and purifiers also makes no sense... 
- is it usual in battles, that you pick up a squad with a transporter and bring it somewhere else?
- would you deploy them mostly empty? (to me 30+ slots are to much. 15slots would be enough. As much is I understood GK; GK-Infantry units are way superior to vehicles... Purpose for vehicles mostly only transportation, so why have them with no passengers?^^)

...for tactics; I'd just use the vehicles to kinda force my enemy to commit to some action -> this might open a situation for a critical deepstrike, or I might be able to take out some units from far before I deepstirke

Thank you so much for your time!

I think if you could help me with above, Im almost rdy for the first battle victory ;p

Neph
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Discussion: Battle Reports / Re: New era battle reports!
« Last post by steam on August 17, 2017, 11:25:38 AM »
Hey there. I made a visit to Helsinki, and had this very fun game there. I think that the fun shows in the report it self. So hope you guys like it.
And also, if you have some suggestions or anything to say at all, pls leave a comment ^^)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFYdihX-zNE
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Discussion: Chaos Space Marines / Re: Has anyone tried doubling up rhinos
« Last post by DCannon4Life on August 17, 2017, 08:19:19 AM »
I have 2x5 CSM with Plasma/Combi-Plasma in one Rhino and 10 Cultists in my other Rhino. Both Rhinos have double combi-bolters.
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Discussion: Space Marines / Re: Scouts army
« Last post by nusphigor on August 17, 2017, 08:15:53 AM »
Thanks mate!

Yes, i agree that the land speeders seem to be quite problematic nowadays :/
So i was thinking of expanding the army to just non power armour taking advantage of some old school grey knight termies that i got yesterday. So i converted them to a shooty termie squad of 5 with assault cannon, a termie captain with combi melta and chainfist and a termie librarian.
So, i was thinkng of adding scout bikers and go for 10th and 1st companies type of army inspired on that fist short story :D

Buuut, the antitank side of the army is severy lacking power...
Any ideas bedide the planes?

That scion idea is a really nice one, i have a small guard force that i could use alongside the marines but i kinda want it to keep them separate at this time, since they are part of an inquisition army that i play from time to time xD.

Cheers mate and thank you
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General Discussion / Re: Ork moral
« Last post by PepeTykki on August 17, 2017, 02:28:24 AM »
You could try to fit some Warp Talons to your list. They might be costly but they beat the living crap out of ork boys in close combat and if you bring them via "deep strike" your opponent can't fire overwatch. Other than that I'll recommend burning them with fire... lots and lots of fire... but you shouldn't rely souly on the "fear" aspect against ork hordes.
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Discussion: Chaos Space Marines / Has anyone tried doubling up rhinos
« Last post by tomjashroom on August 16, 2017, 11:33:55 PM »
The other day a friend of mine pointed out that rhinos can carry a certain number of models and not limited to single squads. So Considering Rhinos are actually pretty survivable now (for 70 pts they should be) and can have 2 squads has anyone tried multiple havoc squads with special weapons in rhinos.

I imagine x10 models with flamers of plasma or melta  jumping out of a rhino would go great with a a frontal assault army.  I could also potentially see some power of committing the ultimate chaos Herasey and mixing units of cult troops in the rhino together. Imagine a bunch of tzeetch guys jumping out rapid firing and a unit of khorne bezerkers assaulting whats left. Pretty dirty I know but im black legion player I'm neutral on the gods until it suits.
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Discussion: Chaos Space Marines / Re: 8th Edition Chaos Wombo Combos and Synergy
« Last post by PepeTykki on August 16, 2017, 10:33:25 PM »
That sounds interesting. I never were much of a Night Lords player my self (but still own 20 Warp Talons for some reason). Maybe I should give them a try.

Chaos Lords are awesome in this new edition. I am now converting a normal Terminator Lord to become the leader of my Death Guard army. I gave him the Puscleaver (Nurgle model only. Replaces the power sword.) wich wounds on a 2+ exept for vehicles. So that will make him to hit on a 2+ and wounding on a 2+, AP -2 and D3 dmg. And then giving him a Combi-Plasma to shoot with. I can't wait to test him out!
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Discussion: Grey Knights / Re: New Player needs help
« Last post by geffthegoat on August 16, 2017, 05:55:32 PM »
Alright, last one before I hit the sack. Sorry for any misspellings or grammar mistakes, I've lost concentration to notice (or care :))

Transports, vehicles and all that jazz:

Rhino's: dirtcheap, durable great for getting close combat units where they are needed. Not that great for GKs as our main combat unit (paladins) cant use them, and dont really need their protection.

Razorbacks: Synergize very well with our army. They are durable and fast, meaning they allow for quick redeployement and protection of strike squads that have tp'd onto the table. Good at evacuating strikes out of melee (fall back out of cc, get into razorback, drive 12" away from dumbfounded enemies). They also provide us with much needed heavy firepower. Best setups are twin assault cannon for an aggressive build, or twin lascannon if you want antitank and to hang back a bit.

Dreadnoughts: cheap, tough, killy. Especially good now that they can actually use our psychic powers. Gate of infinity is scary on melee dreads, astral aim is great for a lascannon missle setup for hunting tanks ad monsters. Another option is going for double flamers and dropping out of a stromraven for 3d6 autohits. Could even jsut give one vortex of doom for a scary tough mortal wound spamming platform

Dreadknight: were great (best unit of the entire codex) last edition, probably still are, now that grandmasters can take them. I personally dont know or care, since I dont own or play any because I dislike the model. I think dreadnoughts are cooler anyway.

Stormraven: flyers are good, and stormraves are no exception. Fast, tough to kill, good for transporting stuff and very deadly, stormravens are always a good option to take. Cant comment on their cousins, the stormtalons, since those only just released this edition.

Land raiders: Much better than last edition. One of the toughest models in the game, lots of transportation room and pretty damn good at its dedicated job depending on its loadout. Vanilla is antitank, crusader is for shredding hordes and redeemer for toasting elite infantry like terminators. Still arent the most competetive unit, though, as they are probably too expensive for what they do. However, I love my land raider, and will always try to find a spot in my list for one.

I hope these replies answer most of your questions. Sorry for the walls of text :P. Im gonna sleep now (its almost 2 am where I am), will try to answer ay questions tomorrow. Good luck and welcome to the fold, fellow brother of titan!

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Discussion: Grey Knights / Re: New Player needs help
« Last post by geffthegoat on August 16, 2017, 05:32:45 PM »
Sorry, just had a short hiccup with my internet that deleted my entire comment on ranged and melee weapons :-[. I'm tired, so I won't rewrite everything, just give the basic gist, but if you have any specific questions, dont hesitate to ask :D

Ranged:

Psycannon: decent allround, but worse this edition. S7 is an awkaward place in the new wounding chart, its cousin the assault cannon got buffed with more shots while it wasnt, and it lost its rend special rule

Incinerators: great against lightly armored toughness 3 models, viable against anything up till T7 and above. Dont expect to be grilling terminators and the like though. Short range and deepstrike rules mean they need transports to be effective.

Psilencer: the new godmode weapon. Insanely cheap, especially for purgation squads. Was buffed immensely, to the point where its a better antitank and antihorde weapon than the psycannon from a costefficiency perspective against anything up to T7. Spam them as much as you can.

Melee:

Sword v Halberd v Falchions
Falchions are the clear winners, getting bonus attacks for free is simply amazing.
Halberds edge out Falchions against T8, especially in conjunction with hammerhand, and are become better than falchions if the unit is large enough (looking at you, paladins + ancient)
Swords are the weakest, while an extra ap is nice, its only situationally (useless against invulnerable saves) better than an extra attack or S.

Staves seem neat, havent tried myself, but could work well in conjunction with sanctuary. One single paladin grabs a stave and sanctuary for a 3+ invulnerable save, 2+ if you use the stratagem. Viable since you can determine wound allocation this edition. Sadly, only works in combat.

Hammers are great. Double S, 3 ap ad 3 damage are a godsend. Equip them on high weapon skill models like grandmasters or paragons to mitigate the hit roll penalty. Also, keeping them close to reroll auras makes helps with reliability.
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Discussion: Grey Knights / Re: New Player needs help
« Last post by geffthegoat on August 16, 2017, 04:46:23 PM »
Paladins and Terminators

Terminators: These guys were a rocksolid choice last edition, dead'ard, killy and good at objective capping. This edition, they've taken quite a blow with the nerf bat. Dont let people talk you into thinking that their extra wound makes them more durable. The new AP system, combined with the fact that weapons can cause multiple damage points means that terminators are roughly only just as tough as they were last edition, as the extra wound compensates for the APvulnerability. The problem is that their price has increased significantly compared to last edition, while not bringing any other buffs apart from the extra wound. While they still are pretty damn good for the points, they absolutely pale in comparison to their direct competitor unit, who cost only 7 points more per model.

Speaking of which: Paladins: These boys musta hit the gym when 8th came around, because holy moley are these suckers good. As mentioned, for a slight increase over Terminators you get an extra wound, an extra attack, a better sergeant, the capability for 2 heavy weapons per 5 models, and have more flexible unit sizes since you can take just three of them if you so please, while terminators are always a minimum of 5. These guys are our workhorses and powerhouses of this edition. They've got dakka fordays with stormbolters and psilencers, and pack one of the meanest punches in combat in the entire game. On top of that, you've got their crazy, 3 wound 2+ armor durability. These guys are MEAN. Not much in the game can be charged by a unit of 10 paladins with hammerhand activated and still swing back at them once their activation phase comes around. These guys also have the best synergy with all of our support characters and auras. Grandmasters for rerolls are devastating, draigo nonwithholding. The ancient is great, buffs the combat power of an already strong unit to insane amounts, and for the apothecary, healing paladins is the most efficient way to make his points back, as well as the easiest, since healing d3 wounds actually matters on these guys. Now, one could argue that terminators have one advantadge over paladins: objective secured. However, as strikes exist, theres no point in terminators as the roll of heavy hitting elite infantry is better filled by paladins, and the role of flexible obsec cappers is better, and more importantly, more cheaply filled by strikes.

To reiterate:
Purgation squads are great.
Purifiers are hot, overcosted gargabe (sadly)
Interceptors are flexible, and situationally useful, but pay the points for it
Terminators are too expensive, or too inadequate to fill either of the rolls they want to.
Paladins are the hammer in your army, expensive, but will win you the game if used correctly.
Strikes are the meat of your army, they provide bodies on the table, objective capability, command points and a stong closerange shooting backbone.

Will continue with weapon options shortly.
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