Author Topic: 8th Edition Competitive Lists for Dark Angels  (Read 4168 times)

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Online Nightwing7x

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8th Edition Competitive Lists for Dark Angels
« on: July 06, 2017, 11:04:46 PM »
Hello again everyone I want your help this time to make a competitive list for 2 separate Dark Angel armies. I am looking to make two 2000 point lists. One for Ravenwing and the other for Deathwing.

I do not know what sticks just yet as I do not have that many games under my belt yet. From what I have seen though the synergy between the wings is gone for now. Which is disappointing as someone who enjoys the fluff of the Dark Angels.

This is what I have been thinking so far, I havent run any points yet, this is just my train of thought.

So firstly for the Deathwing I was going to have it led by Belial and 2 Librarians in terminator armor, maybe trade one out for Ezekiel and stick him in a land raider with squad of knights or normal terminators. Or maybe an interrogator chaplain but since I have Belail he already allows me to reroll failed hits, so I would only take the chaplain for the aura of dread and he is cheaper. The core 3 elite choices I was going to have were to be a Knight squad, an apothecary and an anceint. Then the extra choices I was going to throw in some land raiders, not sure which variant, generic deathwing squads, and maybe another knight squad or champion. I really want a venerable dread but they dont seem worth it honestly now that they can no longer ride in pods, they have lost a lot of mobility, but maybe it would do something as my opponent would focus on the other deathwing squads.

For the Ravenwing the only thing I am certain on is to have it led by Sammael on Corvex, along with again a librarian or interrogator chaplain. Then have a few black knights with the old command squad, apothecary, champion and ancient. throw in a darkshroud or 2 along with a vengence or 2. A dark talon and my nephilim and some generic ravenwing squads with melta guns and maybe an attack bike with multi melta.

I really need your guys feedback on this one however, I really do not know what sticks as it stands and my common enemies are tau, death guard, thousand sons, ultramarines, grey knights, and white scars. Fighting Guilliman is no joke as the Lion is not back yet.
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Online Nightwing7x

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Re: 8th Edition Competitive Lists for Dark Angels
« Reply #1 on: July 09, 2017, 01:34:37 AM »
Hello again fellow sons of the Lion so I have figured out some more specifics for my armies. I now have the beginnings of what I think is a solid Deathwing list. not amazing by any extent but certainly solid. The list is 1250 points.

Vanguard Detachment:

Hq:
Belial: 150
sword of secrets and storm bolter: free

Librarian in terminator armor: 145
force sword: 12
storm bolter: 2

Elites:

Deathwing Knights: 225
5x storm shields: 25
4x maces of absolution: free
1x flail of the unforgiven: free
watcher in the dark: 5

Deathwing Terminator Squad: 130
4x storm bolters: 8
4x power fists: 80
1x power sword: 4 
1x assault or plasma cannon: 21
watcher in the dark: 5

Deathwing Terminator Squad: 130
5x storm bolters: 10
4x power fists: 80
1x power sword: 4
watcher in the dark: 5

Deathwing Ancient: 103
power fist: 20
storm bolter: 2

Deathwing Apothecary: 75
storm bolter: 2

Alright so the plan with the army is to have the knights, ancient and librarian in deepstrike. The librarian will come down with the aforementioned and  cast veil of time on the knights and watch them mulch high priority targets. Then the apothecary along with Belial and the other squads will unfortunately have to foot slog to the enemy, but thats why the apothecary is there, to help mitigate the damage, and Belial for the rerolls. I really want to put a land raider in this list to transport the foot slogers, preferably a crusader. However i am lacking anti armor so maybe a god hammer or a venerable dreadnought. The watchers are also there to stop psychic powers from destroying my squads, such as smite. Plus having the librarian helps.

However please any and all feed back is appreciated and I am still working on the Ravenwing list.
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Offline Tobas DA

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Re: 8th Edition Competitive Lists for Dark Angels
« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2017, 03:22:12 AM »
Hello Nightwing7x,

I did not post for a longer time, but I started playing more again with 8th.

Yesterday I played a 750 points "tournament" and tried out 3 different armies.

Greenwing with Azrael and all plasma (plasma is the way to go I think)

Landraider Crusader (+1 stormbolter) with 5 Deathwing Knights, Asmodai and 1 Tactical Squad

Pure Deathwing 3x 5 Deathwing Terminators with Storm Bolters only and 1 Primaris Lieutenant


Greenwing with plasma is strong, Azrael almost auto include (solid victory but other topic)

Deathwing Knights in a Crusader are excellent, Asmodai now gives 1 extra attack and re-rolls in combat. The Knights wiped everything in CC (1 Cybot, 1 10 man Tactical squads in one round of combat and 1 10 man Tactical squad in the next turn). The Crusader pumps out 12 Assault cannon shots and 28 Bolter shots at 12" and is resilient (only lost 7 wounds).

Pure Deathwing :'( still not very good, got tabled in turn 6.
2 things broke my neck, SMITE (lesson learned: bring the watcher in the dark! and a Librarian if possible). No fire support base, as you mentioned 50% off the units have to start on the table => food slogging is kind of a waste.

Solution for pure Deathwing:
Take a Landraider.
Take 10 man Deathwing Squads to teleport in, with this you can teleport in more models. Fearless, no moral disadvantage. And it is more likely that you have less units and can go first.
Take Venerable Dreadnoughts as fire support base. Twin LC and missile launcher or 2x Twin auto cannons. In the Deathwing game, that I lost, a Hellbrute with twin LC and missile launcher caused big problems for my Termis.
 
General lessons:
You need a "buff commander", Belial, Azrael, Asmodai ...
You need anti Psi with a elite force! Take the watcher.
Mix Deathwing squads with storm shields (~2 per 5), 5+ invul. will not save you. Even better now, because you can choose the model to take the wounds.
Keep the cheap Power sword Sergeant as sacrifice model.
Lightning claw Termis should be good now (on paper). Cheaper than in 7th, 39 points only with 2 wounds and better punch.
Deathwing Knights are better than TH/SS.



 
« Last Edit: July 09, 2017, 03:37:37 AM by Tobas DA »

Online Nightwing7x

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Re: 8th Edition Competitive Lists for Dark Angels
« Reply #3 on: July 09, 2017, 09:41:19 AM »
Those are good pointers and I appreciate the advice, thank you son of the Lion. I think Deathwing is almost impossible to get to work competitively at smaller points so I have increased the points to 1750. The list is now as follows:

Vanguard Detachment:

Hq:
Belial: 150
sword of silence: free
storm bolter: free

Elites:
2x Deathwing Terminator Squads: 260
7x storm bolters: 14
6x power fists: 120
2x power swords: 8
2x storm shields: 10
2x thunder hammers: 20
2x assault cannon or plasma cannon: 42
2x watchers in the dark: 10

Deathwing Knights: 225
5x storm shields: 25
watcher in the dark: 5

Heavy Support:
Land Raider Crusader: 244
2x hurricane bolters: 8
1x twin assault cannon: 35
1x multi metla: 27

Vanguard Detachment:

Hq:
Ezekiel: 145
the deliverer: free
traitors bane: free

Elites:
2x Deathwing Apothecaries: 154
2x storm bolters: 4

Deathwing Champion: 118
halberd of caliban: free

Deathwing Ancient: 103
storm bolter: 2
power fist: 20

Alright so the over all strategy here is to have Ezekiel, the Knights, one apothecary, and the ancient in the crusader pushing forward. The reason I took Ezekiel over the librarian in terminator armor was because Ezekiel is the same points cost as him without any upgrades, and Ezekiel comes with more stuff and stuff to help the Knights do their job. (the book of salvation). Plus he can deny twice a turn on top of the watcher in the dark. While they push up and melt whatever is in their path, whether horde or elite their brothers will teleport into the field. Led by Belial he will take 2, 5 man deathwing squads with him into the heart of the enemy. With other support assets such as the apothecary and champion, all of this will make the enemy split his focus, not being able to entirely kill one unit, and even if they focus their entire army on one portion of this force or another, deathwing are hard to crack, especially with apothecary support on both ends. Subsequently if they pour all of their army into one section of this, then the other section can take advantage of that and counter attack even harder and quicker.

Now to do that ravenwing list.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2017, 07:43:37 AM by Nightwing7x »
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Online Nightwing7x

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Re: 8th Edition Competitive Lists for Dark Angels
« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2017, 09:53:19 PM »
Alright guys I finally have done it, I think I have made a competitive Ravenwing list. The list is below and is 1448 points:

Outrider Detachment:

Hq:
Sammael on Corvex: 183

Librarian on Bike: 119
force sword: 12
twin bolter: 2

Elites:
Ravenwing Apothecary: 97
plasma talons: free
corvus hammer: free

Fast Attack:

5x Ravenwing Black Knights: 250
melta bombs: 5
corvus hammers: free
plasma talons: free

6x Ravenwing Bikes: 204
1x melta gun: 17

6x Ravenwing Bikes: 204
2x melta guns: 34

Ravenwing Dark Talon: 180
2x hurricane bolters: 8
stasis bomb: free
rift cannon: free

Landspeeder Vengeance: 132
heavy bolter: 10
plasma storm battery: free

So the idea is to have Sammael and the Black knights either hang back, allowing the normal ravenwing squads go in as screen units, while the apothecary hangs around where needed, whether healing or bringing bikes back to life he will play a valuable role. The librarian will try to be in the middle of everything for psychic support. The Dark Talon will push forward with either the black knight squads or the normal squads, providing cover fire and being a fire magnet. Finally the vengeance will be pure fire support, eliminating big threats such as dreadknights, hellblasters, tau suits/commanders, tyranid monsters etc.

Please any and all constructive criticism is welcomed.
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Offline Tobas DA

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Re: 8th Edition Competitive Lists for Dark Angels
« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2017, 01:40:28 AM »
Hi,

no Darkshroud? I think the -1 to hit bubble is important, combined with aversion and hard to hit (Darktalon) it is nasty. And the Darkshroud is a fire magnet.

The Black-knights should still be OK, I would try the grenade launcher, 2D6 frag shots or D3 damage krak shots at 24" assault. I think a strong point is, that you can advance the BK 20" (gain jink save) and still shoot.

Ravenwing Bikes I donīt know, have not played them. Ad a Heavy Bolter Attack Bike as cost efficient sacrifice model with 4 wounds (FAQ 2 attacks). You can shoot the twin bolters and the special weapon with no penalty. Take all melta/ combi melta or flamer/ combi flamer (unit of 3 => 3D6 auto hits and 14 bolter shots/ 2 with combi bolter on 4+).
I am glad, that I did not convert to grav  :)

For plasma take the Black Knights.

Sammael, Librarian, Dark Talon I would also take them, good choice.



Online Nightwing7x

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Re: 8th Edition Competitive Lists for Dark Angels
« Reply #6 on: July 13, 2017, 09:23:03 AM »
Thank you for the advice battle brother.

I agree a darkshroud would be nice but I needed something that would play more of a long range support role that could deal with big monsters and vehicles so I went with the vengeance, I will play test however and see which I like more.

The reason I am not using the grenade launchers is due to the plasma talons also being assault weapons. They are assault 2 S7 Ap-3 18". I would much rather have the 6" reduction in range over a grenade launcher, as the plasma talon is better in every department, minus damage arguably and the plasma talons can kill you but only if you want them to.

Ravenwing Bikes are good to me because as mentioned before they are a screen unit for the black knights. They can also be a strong unit on their own while they cannot advance and fire their weapons like black knights they can take melta guns, which are threatening to nearly everything. Melta guns on top of their relatively cheap cost, mobility, 2 wounds and twin bolters are great in squads of 6.

Thank you for the advice again brother.
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Offline Tobas DA

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Re: 8th Edition Competitive Lists for Dark Angels
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2017, 12:56:36 AM »
Yes offense is the best defense.

You can never have enough firepower  8)

The Vengeance seems solid now (compared to normal Land-speeders)