Author Topic: Cypher's Chosen  (Read 2179 times)

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Offline Ragimund

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Cypher's Chosen
« on: December 02, 2015, 08:19:55 AM »
I'm planning to build a chosen squad as fallen dark angels by using the dark angels veterans and chaos space marines chirugeon backpack set with some extra bits scavenged elsewhere.

I don't want to make them too point-expensive so they can still be fielded alongside a regular army. I was thinking about giving the champion a power sword and two plasma guns to the chosen.

What do you guys think? Should I keep them as cheap as possible as ablative wounds for Cypher, or should I go all-in on plasma or melta guns? Please keep in mind that they have no access to dedicated transports.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2015, 11:58:02 AM by Ragimund »

Online SharkoutofWata

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Re: Cypher's Chosen
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2015, 08:59:55 AM »
Cheap is always better with Chosen.  They have no extra survivability to a normal CSM, no Fearless, now no Mark because of Cypher.  They're honestly a bad idea no matter how you cut it but keeping them cheap is the easiest way to make that point sink hurt less.

Keep in mind, I play the most expensive Chosen squad I can in my CSM, so while the above is tactically sound advice, sometimes it is just more fun to throw logic and caution to the wind and go all in for the fun of it.

Offline Grubthak

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Re: Cypher's Chosen
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2015, 12:44:49 AM »
A good use of  Chosen is by giving them four plasma guns and a champion with plasma pistol then chucking them in a rhino. If you have spare points after that give them some extra models (and if you want to go all out give them mark of Nurgle).

However because you are using them as Cypher's fallen I'd suggest taking as many plasma weapons as possible and giving them extra models for the plasma gunners to hide behind. Keep in mind this could give you 12 infiltrating plasma guns which can be devastating for your opponent and, if you give them maximum unit sizes, a great distraction carnifex. However this could get very pricey.

Hope this helps.
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Online SharkoutofWata

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Re: Cypher's Chosen
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2015, 01:18:45 AM »
A good use of  Chosen is by giving them four plasma guns and a champion with plasma pistol then chucking them in a rhino. If you have spare points after that give them some extra models (and if you want to go all out give them mark of Nurgle).

Havocs do this same thing for less points.  Doesn't help with the question asked, but just to spread the word on a frequently missed use of Havocs.

Offline Chaos_Inquisitor

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Re: Cypher's Chosen
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2015, 10:42:56 AM »
Problem with one of the above statements, while you can add many more models to the chosen, ONLY four can take the weapons arrangements.  So, no, you can not have a full 9 man squad of Chosen all with Plasma Guns, and a Champion with whatever gear.

Honestly it's a bit of a snafu with Chosen.  Cypher is a monster in shooting, but he's also extremely dangerous in Assault.  Honestly though...the Chosen are nothing more than ablative wounds for Cypher, nothing more....but nothing less too.  Given them upgrades or not,  is fully up to the player.  If anything just a plain Combi-bolter for them.  3 pts a model and you get your basic bolter stats, but with twin-linked.  Honestly for Cypher's Chosen...that's probably one of the better things, since they come with a close combat weapon already.

Offline Dirty Harry

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Re: Cypher's Chosen
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2015, 06:28:18 AM »
From what I've seen, Cypher's chosen are the only chaos guys with ATSKNF so there's that to keep in mind. If I were to give em anything it would be a few plasma pistols and maybe a power weapon or two to help win combats. Marks seem unnessesary, maybe mark of nurgle if you don't want em dead on arrival.
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Offline Chaos_Inquisitor

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Re: Cypher's Chosen
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2015, 03:41:58 PM »
Cypher's Chosen can't take Marks.

Offline Voidraven5829

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Re: Cypher's Chosen
« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2015, 06:23:53 PM »
Ive been running my Cypher Chosen with 4 melta guns and a combi melta on the champ. With infiltrate they are great for popping dangerous tanks early game, and Cypher's own unit gets shrouded for a little extra survivability. They also work as a decent distraction to tie up your opponent on their side of the board while the rest of your army take mid field objectives.
I personally don't run plasma because i dislike the idea of paying extra to kill your own models (i have horrid luck with plasma across the board). Yeah, it's extra shots, but melta Instant death's things like... Paladins, non-eternal wsrrior hqs, and it has the added bonus of wrecking any tank withing sight. Plus, melta is assault. So if you feel inclined, you can shoot, and if the tank is still standing, charge in and powerfist it for 5 points (dirty move since its a typo, but it hasn't been errata-ed yet so... Do or do not)
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Offline Ragimund

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Re: Cypher's Chosen
« Reply #8 on: December 11, 2015, 11:06:21 AM »
Thank you for your input. I took all advise into consideration. Only chosen are allowed in Cypher's formation, without marks or Rhino. So I have to dismiss the comments about these subject for the purpose of building Cypher's bodyguards.

Seen as Cypher is an objective on his own (at least from a Dark Angels point of view), the chosen are just reasonably expensive ablative wounds. The cheaper the unit, the better.

However, Cypher has the abillity to bestow outflank on the unit he joines (maybe I should have mentioned this earlier). I feel that I should incorporate this powerfull USR into my tactics. Seen as they cannot charge on the round they arrive from reserves, they should at least have some sort of alpha strike.

Also, the champion of the chosen has the champion of chaos rule. As long as he lives he has to issue and accept challanges instead of Cypher.

I came up with the following compromise, trying to find a balance between cost, effectiveness and purpose. I'll give the champion a power sword so he becomes a more effective challanger.
The remaining four chosen ones all get a combi-plasma. I think the greater range and number of potential shots are better suited for their mission then melta guns for the same cost. They will probably not get the chance to fire a second salvo, but should be able to cripple a unit when arriving from the outflanking reserves.

Besides, I think this represents de plasma-fetish of the (former) Dark Angels better ;).






« Last Edit: December 11, 2015, 11:08:41 AM by Ragimund »